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Tough couple of weeks

The Mixed Mamba

The Jack Dunlap Club
Gold Member
Dec 7, 2015
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Charlotte, NC
I couldn't imagine a worst start as POTUS...

Approval rating is already similar to W's across all the major polls.

His hard on for Putin. Wtf?

Travel ban shot down by judges.

Mexico not funding his wall.

No tax records even though he claimed he would show during his campaign.

Kellyanne showing that she has zero idea what she's doing.


Is it time to give Pence a shot at this before it's too late? We knew it would come at some point.
 
it's a disaster and as much as i dislike mike pence, he's at least competent, has some set of principles, and won't go on a twitter rant everytime someone disagrees with him. he also presumably understands the basic concepts of the constitution, something that seems to elude our orange leader.
 
I couldn't imagine a worst start as POTUS...

Approval rating is already similar to W's across all the major polls.

His hard on for Putin. Wtf?

Travel ban shot down by judges.

Mexico not funding his wall.

No tax records even though he claimed he would show during his campaign.

Kellyanne showing that she has zero idea what she's doing.


Is it time to give Pence a shot at this before it's too late? We knew it would come at some point.


On the bright side, nothing could be worse than the last eight years.
 
MAGA gonna go on a 8 year run that's gonna put the liberals out of power for a generation.
Hell, they're already out of power every where except in California and New York. Even in DC they on the outside looking in. When Trump finishes the Supreme Court, it's gonna be 7-3, conservatives.
 
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Say what you want about Obama and we all know he had his flaws, but at no point in the last 8 years was the United States the laughing stock of the world like it is today. It's really not debatable.

Spot on. I was in Toronto the week before last. Half of their news was dedicated to pretty much laughing at us. pretty similar to when I was in Europe recently as well.
 
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Spot on. I was in Toronto the week before last. Half of their news was dedicated to pretty much laughing at us. pretty similar to when I was in Europe recently as well.

This sad state of affairs is present today because of ALL politicians the past 30 years. We haven't had good genuine leadership in over three decades. Still don't!
 
Say what you want about Obama and we all know he had his flaws, but at no point in the last 8 years was the United States the laughing stock of the world like it is today. It's really not debatable.
Actually we were, everybody knew Barry was weak. Red line fiasco in Syria, the Chinese rubbing his face in the dirt, and the Russians picking on him. Not too mention paying millions to Iran to build up their military and terrorism.
That's why he's lost more legislature seats than any President in our nations history.
 
Actually we were, everybody knew Barry was weak. Red line fiasco in Syria, the Chinese rubbing his face in the dirt, and the Russians picking on him. Not too mention paying millions to Iran to build up their military and terrorism.
That's why he's lost more legislature seats than any President in our nations history.

You can admit it, he tricked you during his campaign into voting for him
 
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Say what you want about Obama and we all know he had his flaws, but at no point in the last 8 years was the United States the laughing stock of the world like it is today. It's really not debatable.
Using the same logic as the left with W, doesn't the right have 7.9 more years to blame this on Obama? Or did the US just become the laughing stock in January?
 
Policies aside, there has never been anyone as ignorant, as stupid, as childish, as petty, as incompetent than Trump when it comes to the presidency. He could have the best policies that a president has ever had but the way he acts will always be laughed at. The man is an absolute joke when it comes to being a leader. He has zero qualities of what a person should have to run this country. And the fact that people think that how he acts is what we need to for our country is beyond laughable and says a lot about those people and their intellect.
 
wow i just watched that and that is funny!!!
Clinton and Obama both saying that immigration is a big problem. Even Obama saying he has the power for being President he can do something about it. Not a peep out of the media during those times but Trump is trying to do something and it's the end of times coming from the media and the left. This country is going to fall apart from the inside.
 
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The last admin had one of the worst economic outputs in decades. Obama is the only president EVER not to reach 3% gdp growth, EVER. We have the lowest employment percentage (labor participation rate) in 40-50 yrs. AND he accomplished all this by spending more $ than every other president combined.
You can try to spin the facts anyway you want to. You can say it is Bush's fault, you can say it is Regan's fault, you can say it is Trumps fault if you want to. It doesn't change the facts. There is absolutely no logical argument to be made that he is not the worst president we have ever had.

Any reasonable person with any critical thinking skills that would turn off cnn, nbc, abc, cbs, msnbc, fox and all the other people telling them what they want you to believe and just look at the facts should be able to figure this out for themselves. The facts/data are out there if you really want to find the truth for yourself instead of just listening to some talking heads feeding you what they want you to believe. No one would run their family finances this way and no business on earth would operate like this because it defies all logic. Yet somehow we seem to think it is ok for the govt to do that with our money. If there are any finance majors out there try figuring out what the ROI on the $10 trillion we spent was.

It is astonishing to me how our society has just been willing to accept ideas from the media that are clearly contradicted by the facts. Can anyone think for themselves anymore? When we have just spent almost $10 TRILLION only to have the fewest people working and one of the worst eight years of economic growth ever, it is literally unbelievable to me that people have no idea what is actually happening in the country the live in. If we had to pay our debt today, every man woman and child would owe over $60,000 each........ just think about that for a minute. rladams, if I remember correctly you have a wife and two daughters (forgive me if I am wrong). That means your family's share of the national debt is about a quarter of a million dollars- about twice what it was eight years ago. Does this not concern you? That number will likely increase dramatically over the next 15-20 yrs as the large baby boomer generation dies leaving a smaller population base to spread that out over.

Don't think this is just Obama bashing. I AM bashing Obama, but not just him. Bush spent way too much $ as well was not very high on the list of presidents either. Also, I was not a trump guy and am still weary about the outcome of the next four years. Still, it would be almost impossible to do worse than the last eight years if you actually look at the facts.
If we as a society don't learn to think for ourselves based on verifiable facts instead of just adopting a belief simply because you are being told the same lie over and over we are doomed as a society and a country.
It used to be that the press would point out the lies or at least question them. Now, however, they simply perpetuate them. We have to stop relying on the television and seek the truth for ourselves. Anyone that can do simple math and trust the numbers rather than what they have been spoon-fed by the media should be outraged at where we are as a country. Unfortunately, if you tell most people the same lie long enough, they end up believing it.
 
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The last admin had one of the worst economic outputs in decades. Obama is the only president EVER not to reach 3% gdp growth, EVER. We have the lowest employment percentage (labor participation rate) in 40-50 yrs. AND he accomplished all this by spending more $ than every other president combined.
You can try to spin the fact anyway you want to. You can say it is Bush's fault, you can say it is Regan's fault, you can say it is Trumps fault if you want to. It doesn't change the facts. There is absolutely no logical argument to be made that he is not the worst president we have ever had.
Any reasonable person with any critical thinking skills that would turn off cnn, nbc, abc, cbs, msnbc, fox and all the other people telling them what they want you to believe and just look at the facts for themselves should be able to figure this out for themselves. The facts/data are out there if you really want to find the truth for yourself instead of just listening to some talking heads feeding you what they want you to believe. No one would run their family finances this way and no business on earth would operate like this because it defies all logic. Yet somehow we seem to think it is ok for the govt to do that with your money. If there are any finance majors out there try figuring out what the ROI on the $10 trillion we spent was.

It is astonishing to me how our society has just been willing to accept ideas from the media that are clearly contradicted by the facts. Can anyone think for themselves anymore? When we have just spent almost $10 TRILLION only to have the fewest people working and one of the worst eight years of economic growth ever, it is literally unbelievable to me that people have no idea what is actually happening in the country the live in. If we had to pay our debt today, every man woman and child would owe over $60,000 each........ just think about that for a minute. rladams, if I remember correctly you have a wife and two daughters(forgive me if I am wrong). That means your family's share of the national debt is about a quarter of a million dollars- about twice what it was eight years ago. Does this not concern you? That number will likely increase dramatically over the next 15-20 yrs as the large baby boomer generation dies leaving a smaller population base to spread that out over.

Don't think this is just Obama bashing. I AM bashing Obama, but not just him. Bush spent way too much $ as well was not very high on the list of presidents either. Also, I was not a trump guy and am still weary about the outcome of the next four years. Still, it would be almost impossible to do worse than the last eight years if you actually look at the facts. If we as a society don't learn to think for ourselves based on verifiable facts instead of just adopting a belief simply because you are being told the same lie over and over we are doomed as a society and a country. It used to be that the press would point out the lies or at least question them. Now, however, they simply perpetuate them. We have to stop relying on the television and seek the truth for ourselves. Anyone that can do simple math and trust the numbers rather than what they have been spoon-fed by the media should be outraged at where we are as a country. Unfortunately, if you tell most people the same lie long enough, they end up believing it.

This is just not accurate. You been fed garbage. Trusted economic indicators show the last presidency was successful. If you want to talk abt the national debt that has increased under the last 2 presidents or the increased healthcare costs under Obama, I will respect that. But to act like the economy did not drastsically improve during his 8 years is laughable.
 
Clinton and Obama both saying that immigration is a big problem. Even Obama saying he has the power for being President he can do something about it. Not a peep out of the media during those times but Trump is trying to do something and it's the end of times coming from the media and the left. This country is going to fall apart from the inside.
Most of the backlash he is receiving in my view is just a basic dislike of him as a person not what he may or may not do for our country. In addition I think people for sure don't want him to succeed because it will shine a brighter light on how bad previous pres have done. Most of the people he has put on his team are very good people and the SC selection looks to be very qualified, yet they just don't like the person and never will.
 
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Most of the backlash he is receiving in my view is just a basic dislike of him as a person not what he may or may not do for our country. In addition I think people for sure don't want him to succeed because it will shine a brighter light on how bad previous pres have done. Most of the people he has put on his team are very good people and the SC selection looks to be very qualified, yet they just don't like the person and never will.

lol what? i agree that gorsuch is a solid and highly qualified SC pick, but the rest of his appointees and advisors are an absolute disaster. on the advisor level, steve bannon is one of the more horrifying people to ever obtain a position of power. and jeff session, betsy devos, rick perry, etc. were all tremendously awful and sometimes outright incompetent selections. devos essentially paid her way to her position, and rick perry didn't even know what the department of energy did prior to him selected, despite at one time advocating for its dismantling.
 
Clinton and Obama both saying that immigration is a big problem. Even Obama saying he has the power for being President he can do something about it. Not a peep out of the media during those times but Trump is trying to do something and it's the end of times coming from the media and the left. This country is going to fall apart from the inside.
This is hilarious, because its only about partisan politics for you. Here are democrats being tough on vetting those that come into the country. I bet you claim both presidents were weak on terror, while in the same breath claiming some kind of straw man hypocrisy somehow from false equivalency of banning greencard and visa owners from entering the country.

You thought process doesn't make sense. It's like you see a D supports restricting immigration and that somehow means they should support an all out ban? If I'm for drinking more water in a day, does that make me pro drowning? Because thats the kind of logic you are using.

People in this country need to focus on policies not politics.
 
@jimbob1019 get in here and defend this piss poor start for you boy. You didn't call this one accurately
What's piss poor about it??

He's actually getting things done...

Let's see...he ended TPP, restarted the process to get the Dakota & Keystone Pipelines projects going, set the wheels in motion for a border wall, has been DIRECTLY credited with keeping jobs here & bringing new jobs as well, has reaffirmed the nation's support for our military, given Gen. Mattis the keys to the military & has vowed to destroy ISIS, has reaffirmed this nation's support for our police force, nominated an excellent judge for the Supreme Court, all of his cabinet appointees have been confirmed thus far, signed orders for the DOJ to create a task force to combat crime & cartels, etc. etc. etc.

The only thing that has really been a battle so far has been the temporary immigration ban in order to put more thorough vetting procedures in place which ONLY MAKES SENSE but Trump will win that one too...just a matter of time...

You see, the liberal media outlets aren't gonna go away & they will continue to spin things with their liberal propanganda...that doesn't change the fact that President Trump is getting things done.
 
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This is just not accurate. You been fed garbage. Trusted economic indicators show the last presidency was successful. If you want to talk abt the national debt that has increased under the last 2 presidents or the increased healthcare costs under Obama, I will respect that. But to act like the economy did not drastsically improve during his 8 years is laughable.

I have not been "fed" anything. That was my whole point. YOU evidently believe what you have been fed. By what metric has the economy improved? What facts that I stated are not true? There are statistics on employment, gdp, debt, etc that anyone can find in a relatively short period of time if you just google them. I got my gdp fact right off the govt (bea) website. These are not "facts" I am pulling from some news/magazine article with some type of agenda. The average gdp growth over the last eight years is just under 1.5%. Even if you take away 2009(the worst year) it averaged just under 2% growth. Like I said, I am not a big fan of the Bush presidency either, but gdp growth under him was about 1% a year HIGHER than Obama. Even if you give bush the negative growth for the 2009 year his average GDP growth is significantly higher that the last seven years under Obama.

You can say the economy was better under Obama if you want to, but the facts simply do not support that notion. I can tell you that 2+2=12, that doesn't make it true.

Instead of just telling me what you believe, give some numbers/facts to support what you think. They don't exist. When you try to find the facts, I think you may be surprised. I don't want you to take my word for it, or anyone else's.

I really don't care if you even respond. I am not trying to get you to tell me I am right, i don't care about that. That wont change/help anything. Just go get the facts/data for yourself. Not just about gdp or employment, about everything, and not just you everyone. That is what will save our country.

Look,I strongly disagree with you about the economy, but I have read enough of your post to know you are an intelligent and reasonable person. I just want you (and everyone who is capable) to quit relying on other people to tell them what to believe and actually find out the facts and make your own judgements because there are very, very few media sources out there that are relaying accurate information.
 
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The TPP has been dead since before the election. But I'm glad Trump won't support it.
 
I have not been "fed" anything. That was my whole point. YOU evidently believe what you have been fed. By what metric has the economy improved? What facts that I stated are not true? There are statistics on employment, gdp, debt, etc that anyone can find in a relatively short period of time if you just google them. I got my gdp fact right off the govt (bea) website. These are not "facts" I am pulling from some news/magazine article with some type of agenda. The average gdp growth over the last eight years is just under 1.5%. Even if you take away 2009(the worst year) it averaged just under 2% growth. Like I said, I am not a big fan of the Bush presidency either, but gdp growth under him was about 1% a year HIGHER than Obama. Even if you give bush the negative growth for the 2009 year his average GDP growth is significantly higher that the last seven years under Obama.

You can say the economy was better under Obama if you want to, but the facts simply do not support that notion. I can tell you that 2+2=12, that doesn't make it true.

Instead of just telling me what you believe, give some numbers/facts to support what you think. They don't exist. When you try to find the facts, I think you may be surprised. I don't want you to take my word for it, or anyone else's.

I really don't care if you even respond. I am not trying to get you to tell me I am right, i don't care about that. That wont change/help anything. Just go get the facts/data for yourself. Not just about gdp or employment, about everything, and not just you everyone. That is what will save our country.

Look,I strongly disagree with you about the economy, but I have read enough of your post to know you are an intelligent and reasonable person. I just want you (and everyone who is capable) to quit relying on other people to tell them what to believe and actually find out the facts and make your own judgements because there are very, very few media sources out there that are relaying accurate information.

The problem is that you've completely cherry-picked economic stats that fit with your narrative. Yes, GDP growth was underwhelming during Obama's presidency. On the other hand, unemployment and the stock market improved greatly during that same period. A low inflation rate and a reduction in the federal budget deficit were also considered "wins" for Obama's economic record. Why are you not willing to construct a full picture? Based on your posting history, I would guess it owes to partisanship.
 
This is hilarious, because its only about partisan politics for you. Here are democrats being tough on vetting those that come into the country. I bet you claim both presidents were weak on terror, while in the same breath claiming some kind of straw man hypocrisy somehow from false equivalency of banning greencard and visa owners from entering the country.

You thought process doesn't make sense. It's like you see a D supports restricting immigration and that somehow means they should support an all out ban? If I'm for drinking more water in a day, does that make me pro drowning? Because thats the kind of logic you are using.

People in this country need to focus on policies not politics.
Has nothing to do with partisan politics. Has to do with the ideology and the direction of leadership this country is heading. I've got a daughter and doesn't matter what any media, statistics, or anyone else says this world is a mess and all I want for her and all children is to have the best life as possible. Maybe you can give me a link but for as I know Clinton or Obama didn't try to do anything to help with the immigration problem. I think we as a country needs to step back and look at the situation and find a better solution cause if you don't think they would love to come here and cause death and destruction then I'm sorry we just disagree. I'm not saying Trump is the answer but I do know without a doubt we haven't had a true leader for all Americans since Reagan. I found this article about Obama immigration.
http://www.cfr.org/immigration/us-supreme-court-obamas-immigration-actions/p37630
 
The problem is that you've completely cherry-picked economic stats that fit with your narrative. Yes, GDP growth was underwhelming during Obama's presidency. On the other hand, unemployment and the stock market improved greatly during that same period. A low inflation rate and a reduction in the federal budget deficit were also considered "wins" for Obama's economic record. Why are you not willing to construct a full picture? Based on your posting history, I would guess it owes to partisanship.

If this was joke/troll than you got me. I hope it was for your sake.
GDP growth is far and away the most used indicator of economic growth. What metric do you suggest for measuring economic growth? Low inflation generally happens with poor economic growth. Additionally, the federal reserve has helped to manipulate inflation by unprecedented manipulation in the bond market.
As for the unemployment rate, that is a very misleading number during periods where people have been unemployed for long periods of time. It does not count people who have quit looking for work even though they are still unemployed. The labor participation rate is a much more accurate representation of employment/unemployment because you can not manipulate that number. It simply states the percentage of people working as a portion of the available workforce. We know how many working age people there are and we know how many people have jobs. There is almost no way to manipulate those numbers. The unemployment rate, however does not count the millions of people who have quit looking for work. Simple logic should tell anyone that if fewer people (as a percentage of working age Americans) are working now than any other time in the last 40-50 years that we have a huge employment (and unemployment) problem and that the current unemployment rate is a farce. Does that not make any sense to you? Do you really not understand this?
Concerning the budget...... I can not believe anyone could be as either disingenuous or unintelligent to suggest there was anything positive relating to our debt during the last eight years. It is absolutely ludicrous to imply our debt situation somehow improved because we showed a federal budget reduction one year. Talk about not constructing a full picture! That is like a husband saying he had reduced his debt by paying off his $5000 car loan, when his wife went out and borrowed $100000 and gave him $5k of it to pay his car off. The bottom line is we spent an enormous amount of $$. How you want to classify all that debt really is meaningless. Just because it was not attributed to the federal budget doesn't mean he didn't spend the money or that we don't have to pay it back.

Maybe you don't really understand these statistics (gdp, labor participation rate, unemployment, etc). Maybe you just happened to be quoting from some recent article you read about Obama, I really don't know what the explanation is, but the facts about our economic situation over the last eight years are terrible. I know this is hard for people who depend on the media to get all their information because we have been lied to for quite some time. As for the partisan issue, I will be the first to admit Bush sucked as well on this front and others. That doesn't change the fact that the last eight years have been abysmal and much worse than the prior eight. I don't know if the next four or eight yrs will be better or not. It is hard to imagine they could be worse. If they are not better then we will likely be in a financial/economic position from which it will take us several decades to recover from, if we recover at all.
 
If this was joke/troll than you got me. I hope it was for your sake.
GDP growth is far and away the most used indicator of economic growth. What metric do you suggest for measuring economic growth? Low inflation generally happens with poor economic growth. Additionally, the federal reserve has helped to manipulate inflation by unprecedented manipulation in the bond market.
As for the unemployment rate, that is a very misleading number during periods where people have been unemployed for long periods of time. It does not count people who have quit looking for work even though they are still unemployed. The labor participation rate is a much more accurate representation of employment/unemployment because you can not manipulate that number. It simply states the percentage of people working as a portion of the available workforce. We know how many working age people there are and we know how many people have jobs. There is almost no way to manipulate those numbers. The unemployment rate, however does not count the millions of people who have quit looking for work. Simple logic should tell anyone that if fewer people (as a percentage of working age Americans) are working now than any other time in the last 40-50 years that we have a huge employment (and unemployment) problem and that the current unemployment rate is a farce. Does that not make any sense to you? Do you really not understand this?
Concerning the budget...... I can not believe anyone could be as either disingenuous or unintelligent to suggest there was anything positive relating to our debt during the last eight years. It is absolutely ludicrous to imply our debt situation somehow improved because we showed a federal budget reduction one year. Talk about not constructing a full picture! That is like a husband saying he had reduced his debt by paying off his $5000 car loan, when his wife went out and borrowed $100000 and gave him $5k of it to pay his car off. The bottom line is we spent an enormous amount of $$. How you want to classify all that debt really is meaningless. Just because it was not attributed to the federal budget doesn't mean he didn't spend the money or that we don't have to pay it back.

Maybe you don't really understand these statistics (gdp, labor participation rate, unemployment, etc). Maybe you just happened to be quoting from some recent article you read about Obama, I really don't know what the explanation is, but the facts about our economic situation over the last eight years are terrible. I know this is hard for people who depend on the media to get all their information because we have been lied to for quite some time. As for the partisan issue, I will be the first to admit Bush sucked as well on this front and others. That doesn't change the fact that the last eight years have been abysmal and much worse than the prior eight. I don't know if the next four or eight yrs will be better or not. It is hard to imagine they could be worse. If they are not better then we will likely be in a financial/economic position from which it will take us several decades to recover from, if we recover at all.

brevity is really not your thing. look, i think it's pretty clear in talking with you that you don't know near as much about economics as you claim. first off, i said GDP was one of many metrics that are used to rate economic health. i never specifically cited something better for pure "economic growth." when you inherit a situation where 700,000 jobs are being lost a month and get it turned around to where there's jobs growth for 75 straight months, something is going well. i'm not even advocating that obama was some wonderful president from an economic perspective; he was extremely average and we'll have to wait and see on the long-term effects of certain regulatory actions. but to classify his time as some calamity, and especially to say that it was clearly much worse than the eight under bush, tells me that you are divorced from reality and agenda-driven.
 
brevity is really not your thing. look, i think it's pretty clear in talking with you that you don't know near as much about economics as you claim. first off, i said GDP was one of many metrics that are used to rate economic health. i never specifically cited something better for pure "economic growth." when you inherit a situation where 700,000 jobs are being lost a month and get it turned around to where there's jobs growth for 75 straight months, something is going well. i'm not even advocating that obama was some wonderful president from an economic perspective; he was extremely average and we'll have to wait and see on the long-term effects of certain regulatory actions. but to classify his time as some calamity, and especially to say that it was clearly much worse than the eight under bush, tells me that you are divorced from reality and agenda-driven.

While I agree with most of Trumps policies so far, I will freely admit he acts like a three year old on the playground whenever he is attacked in his need to get the last word or make people think he is right. It makes me want to punch him in the face and tell him to just shut-up. Also,I stated before that i did not think Bush was a good president, so this is not a partisan politics. I don't know the exact numbers for Bush, but I know he had 50+ consecutive months of job growth and likely several more months of growth that were not consecutive. While this is not 75, I think it was the longest streak ever until obama. It still was not a great economic time period.

I'll briefly restate a few quick facts. Over the last eight years we spent $10 trillion(almost twice as much as the prior 8 yrs), yet there is a lower percentage of the population working despite reported unemployment numbers. It is the first time any president in modern history did not see at least one year of over 3% gdp growth, which has averaged under an abysmal 1.5%. Heathcare costs and insurance have increased dramatically despite the promise that they would decrease. Thanks to the ACA most peoples insurance premiums have increased dramatically, while at the same time their deductibles have risen to the point where many never reach them unless there is a major medical incident. Finally, median inflation adjusted income is lower than it was 8 years ago, which means that under Obama the average household can afford less than they could when he took office. By almost every metric ( jobs, debt, household income, economic growth, home ownership, poverty rates, etc) we are worse off than we were in 2009.

Those are all facts. The most important probably being the fact that we spent more money than ever and yet the average family has seen a decline in income. You can simply stick your head in the sand and deny the facts if you want to, but it does not change the facts.
 
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