OT: Tariff Economics Discussion

[The89Tiger]

It will take a long time.

Change is hard. We have been getting ripped off for 40 years, I don’t think it’s going to change overnight.

They are restructuring global trade. Not going to be easy or quick. Something was necessary. What is arguable.

Trump won, so give him his chance. That’s why we have elections. He isn’t doing anything he didn’t run on. In fact, he is doing exactly what he ran on!

Your assumption is that the Trump administration will have a long time. That is a flaw to me. Lose the midterms, you lose your leverage. You are asking an electorate that is self absorbed and has the attention span of a gnat to play the long game after he campaigned on immediate relief.

I’m still holding out hope it is a negotiating tool in the short term.

Nothing in Trump’s past gives any indication he really cares about levels of debt. He isn’t a true fiscal conservative. That isn't a slap at him, just a fact based on his lifetime of public business behavior.

I still think he is setting up negotiations, he certainly is a master of that.

 

[1Clemson]

When was that?

Must have been before my time

It has been quite a while. We get what we deserve when we elect based off of popularity, soundbites and party loyalty without looking at candidates and their qualifications and positions.

 

[1Clemson]

Your assumption is that the Trump administration will have a long time. That is a flaw to me. Lose the midterms, you lose your leverage. You are asking an electorate that is self absorbed and has the attention span of a gnat to play the long game after he campaigned on immediate relief.

I’m still holding out hope it is a negotiating tool in the short term.

Nothing in Trump’s past gives any indication he really cares about levels of debt. He isn’t a true fiscal conservative. That isn't a slap at him, just a fact based on his lifetime of public business behavior.

I still think he is setting up negotiations, he certainly is a master of that.

One can hope.

 

[Dadar]

I miss the days when there were intelligent grownups in charge of both parties.

We need 4 political parties that force cooperation

 

[TigerGrowls]

Your assumption is that the Trump administration will have a long time. That is a flaw to me. Lose the midterms, you lose your leverage. You are asking an electorate that is self absorbed and has the attention span of a gnat to play the long game after he campaigned on immediate relief.

I’m still holding out hope it is a negotiating tool in the short term.

Nothing in Trump’s past gives any indication he really cares about levels of debt. He isn’t a true fiscal conservative. That isn't a slap at him, just a fact based on his lifetime of public business behavior.

I still think he is setting up negotiations, he certainly is a master of that.

This is some good lib analysis.....LOL!!!

 

[firegiver]

Well you know what? Last time conservatives enacted tariffs like this they lost the house and Senate for 60 years. Y'all might want to think a little bit on Trump's legitimacy

 

[TigerGrowls]

 

[TigerGrowls]

Yes, all the economists that are screaming the tariffs are going to destroy the economy are stupid because they are the same economists who told you that inflation was transitory and that printing 40% of the money supply wouldn’t have any impact on your life. They are the same economists who believe in modern monetary theory where you pretty much abuse your credit card and pretend like the bill never comes.

That does not work and we are living proof in this country that those policies suck.

The only thing the previous administration did was print a ton of money and expand the federal government. All the new jobs went to foreign workers or created new government employees.

That is not a sustainable economy for a global superpower.

To continue to be a global superpower, we need to first stop, allowing every other country in the world to take advantage of us and second we need to incentivize manufacturing back home and the way to do that is through reciprocal tariffs, deregulation, and lower taxes.

Nobody is reinventing the wheel here it’s just that the same expert class who got paid to lie to you about Covid, get paid to lie to you about the economy so stop freaking listening to them.

 

[TigerGrowls]

 

[TigerGrowls]

America!!!

 

[TigerGrowls]

 

[TigerGrowls]

 

[TigerGrowls]

 

[TigerGrowls]

Nobody expects a transition period after more than 40 years of offshoring American industries and letting other countries tariff the shit out of us of, where Trump is bringing industries back and forcing other countries to lower their tariffs on US products to be PAINLESS and EASY.

But make no mistake...what Trump is doing?

IT HAS TO BE DONE.

The people who are arguing for the status quo are not America First.

That includes Rand Paul.

Keep that in mind.

 

[TigerGrowls]

 

[TigerGrowls]

TRUTH!!!



America has become addicted to cheap foreign baubles and easy money (i.e., fake fiat currency) at the expense of its long-term economic health. We allowed ourselves to be transformed from a cast iron economy which made things into a largely paper economy which depends on the good graces of foreign nations for its own survival. This is a recipe for civilizational suicide.

We don’t make our own weapons, food, machines, vehicles, plastics, medicines, or computers. The whole COVID insanity, with its shutdowns and shortages and supply-chain chaos, was a blaring alarm warning us that the economy we thought was so strong was shockingly fragile.

Imagine a prosperous farmer, now surrounded by enemies and competitors, who over time outsourced most farming activities to his neighbors because they could do the work and provide the materials more cheaply than he could. He sold off his equipment and laid off his farm-hands because it was just easier and less expensive for others to do the work and maintain the machinery. But one day, his neighbors said no more, and now he finds himself in the position of being unable to fertilize his land, or plow his fields, or harvest his crops. Even if he had kept his old tractors and implements, he sold off all his welding equipment and spare parts and raw materials, so repairing anything would be impossible. On top of that, he doesn’t remember all that much about repairing the equipment anyway because he hasn’t done it for years.

So now he finds himself in control of once-fertile and productive land that he can’t utilize, and the people he used to rely on for help now refuse to lift a finger, because they see an opportunity to bankrupt their old neighbor and business partner, allowing them to buy up all that land for themselves at fire sale prices.

That’s where America now is as a country. We stripped our economy down and sold it for parts, happy to have the cash in our pockets and ignorant of the possibility the good times could ever end.

Trump has understood these dynamics for decades, and is trying to reset our priorities to give us an economy that isn’t built on a foundation of paper. That requires resetting all of our trade relationships and recreating the conditions that built an economy and civilization that together were the envy of the world.

There will of course be some short-term pain as part of that process. Muscles must ache before they grow stronger. And addicts have to go through withdrawal before they can come out clean on the other side. In fact, the angry reactions from self-styled “free traders” who have gotten rich off of our leaders mortgaging our country’s long-term economic health for short-term cash resemble the drug dealer enraged that one of his best customers is about to go clean. “You’ll never survive the withdrawal symptoms,” he says. “You want what I’m selling. You need it. You can’t live without it.”

The reality is we cannot survive if we continue to remain addicted to cheap foreign crap. We cannot survive if we are unable to make our own food and medicine and vehicles and weapons and computers. A farmer who is wholly dependent upon his enemies to plow and seed and fertilize and harvest his land is a farmer who will starve. Likewise, a nation that depends entirely on its enemies to power its economy is a nation destined to become history rather than shape it.

 

[TigerGrowls]

 

[TigerGrowls]

 

[fatpiggy]

China retaliates. Should get interesting

 

[TigerGrowls]

China retaliates. Should get interesting

I do not think its going to hurt the US that much as we are prevented from being big players in their markets currently anyway. There will be some exceptions Im sure but bring it on as Trump is ready.

 

[fatpiggy]

I do not think its going to hurt the US that much as we are prevented from being big players in their markets currently anyway. There will be some exceptions Im sure but bring it on as Trump is ready.

It will be painful in the short term. Restructuring is not easy.

 

[fatpiggy]

What about the hundreds of PhD economists from every major school that point to the pitfalls?

Oh you mean the ones that got us $37 trillion in debt with record inflation and rising interest rates running a $2 trillion deficit that hollowed out the middle class of America?

Those PhD Economist?

 

[dpic73]

Oh you mean the ones that got us $37 trillion in debt with record inflation and rising interest rates running a $2 trillion deficit that hollowed out the middle class of America?

Those PhD Economist?

 

[fatpiggy]

Total restructure incoming it appears. We needed it badly. Rip the band-aid off. Hold on to your butts.

 

[fatpiggy]

How do you respond to Nancy, Chuck et al?

 

[fatpiggy]

 

[fatpiggy]

I do find it interesting that Nancy changed her tune and then became the best stock trader in history.

 

[TigerGrowls]

View embedded media

Good read.



It is my belief that a lot of this tariff stuff is cover for the central point that Trump is totally decoupling the USA from China. If he came out with that as the main point, it would cause mass panic in the financial sector, but in the last 2 months, Trump has basically put a little more than 100% tariffs on China.

More than any other country by far. Considering China is basically the biggest importer into the USA when you consider a lot of the trade with Mexico and Canada is pass through trade with China to avoid the tariffs. The mexico/Canada tariffs also hit China. The rest of the tariffs stop China from using counties like Vietnam and Canada as vassels to avoid the tariffs. I mentioned this before, but it's becoming very clear to me, at least. This is a full-on undeclared cold war with China.

Covid seems to have woken many people up to the threat we face.

 

[TigerGrowls]

View embedded media

The American workers were literally sold down the river.

 

[dpic73]

How do you respond to Nancy, Chuck et al?

View embedded media

Why should I? Are they the president?

All the whataboutisms in the world can't obscure that this is an epic disaster created by one mam who has no idea what the fvck he's doing.

This has never succeeded before and it won't succeed now but at least we can get a good laugh from your sprinkles storm.

 

[TigerGrowls]

Here's a huge point that's good the USA.



Tariffs are not the story!

Since Trump took office in Jan 2025, the 10-year yield has dropped from 4.79% to 4.17%. Look how much it’s dropped today!

That 0.62% drop may not sound like much—until you realize the U.S. has $36.5 trillion in debt.

This is stealth refinancing on a historic scale.

Lower yields = trillions in interest savings.
More breathing room. Less inflationary pressure.
And the market is front-running it.

Everyone’s watching tariffs.
But this yield curve shift?
It’s the real game.

Trump isn’t just cutting spending—
he’s restructuring America’s balance sheet in real time.

 

[dpic73]

Here's a huge point that's good the USA.

View embedded media

Tariffs are not the story!

Since Trump took office in Jan 2025, the 10-year yield has dropped from 4.79% to 4.17%. Look how much it’s dropped today!

That 0.62% drop may not sound like much—until you realize the U.S. has $36.5 trillion in debt.

This is stealth refinancing on a historic scale.

Lower yields = trillions in interest savings.
More breathing room. Less inflationary pressure.
And the market is front-running it.

Everyone’s watching tariffs.
But this yield curve shift?
It’s the real game.

Trump isn’t just cutting spending—
he’s restructuring America’s balance sheet in real time.

 

[BlueRidgedf]

I do find it interesting that Nancy changed her tune and then became the best stock trader in history.

View embedded media

Nobody give a shi_ what Nancy Pelosi said 30 years ago Good Lord.

 

[fatpiggy]

Why should I? Are they the president?

All the whataboutisms in the world can't obscure that this is an epic disaster created by one mam who has no idea what the fvck he's doing.

This has never succeeded before and it won't succeed now but at least we can get a good laugh from your sprinkles storm.

You should care because maybe it will help you determine if you are mad at the policy or are you just hysterically mad at the person. (aka TDS).

Did you disagree with the policy when Nancy and Chuck were proposing it? What changed since then that would change their position? I'm open to hearing things changed and therefore their position is outdated, but what changed?

 

[Cocks are Number 1]

Simpleton

 

[firegiver]

What's hilarious is if you look into the formula for these 'reciprical' tariffs, they are just simpleton mathematics. Saw someone ask chatgpt how to impose tariffs and it came up with the same answer but with the caveat that it would likely cause great harm to global economies.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/how-trump-came-up-with-his-reciprocal-tariff-formula-145530164.html

You guys better stop pretending and rationalizing all this and hope and pray this is just a 'negotiating tactic'.

 

[dpic73]

You should care because maybe it will help you determine if you are mad at the policy or are you just hysterically mad at the person. (aka TDS).

Did you disagree with the policy when Nancy and Chuck were proposing it? What changed since then that would change their position? I'm open to hearing things changed and therefore their position is outdated, but what changed?

Did they propose imposing high tariffs (taxes on Americans) against every country on the planet except for Russia? Did they propose tariffs against countries that can't afford to buy our goods like Cambodia and Vietnam?

I can look at my brokerage account, my 401k and see the recession on the horizon to understand why I'm mad.

It's the economy stupid.

 

[WapPride]

What's hilarious is if you look into the formula for these 'reciprical' tariffs, they are just simpleton mathematics. Saw someone ask chatgpt how to impose tariffs and it came up with the same answer but with the caveat that it would likely cause great harm to global economies.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/how-trump-came-up-with-his-reciprocal-tariff-formula-145530164.html

You guys better stop pretending and rationalizing all this and hope and pray this is just a 'negotiating tactic'.

This shit is incredible.

 

[dpic73]

Simpleton

Trumplidunce

 

[uuuuuuuuuuuuuuu]

Did they propose imposing high tariffs (taxes on Americans) against every country on the planet except for Russia? Did they propose tariffs against countries that can't afford to buy our goods like Cambodia and Vietnam?

I can look at my brokerage account, my 401k and see the recession on the horizon to understand why I'm mad.

It's the economy stupid

Trump is game changing but everyone else was doing it anyway so you can’t complain. Don’t bother trying to understand

I wish people would realize the stock market isn’t all about the uber rich. We’re talking about middle class inheritances and 401ks getting smacked. I feel sick. People work their whole lives to save a million or two, and this moron comes along, wipes out a hundred thousand at a time, and has the audacity to tell them to get over it. It’s all “temporary” pain. And for what??? We don’t work on the farm anymore. We don’t work in the factory anymore. Our economy advanced beyond it!

It was shitty with Biden, and it’s shittier now