So... About those Russian Contacts?

[Ron Munson]

Perhaps and that's the reason I'm voted for him but I dont have much faith. The partisan divide in this country for the last 10 years is stopping progress.

I agree that the divide is stopping progress, and it isn't going to get any better. I don't think you will see another moderate for a while.

 

[Howard's Jock]

Perhaps and that's the reason I'm voted for him but I dont have much faith. The partisan divide in this country for the last 10 years is stopping progress.

I agree that the divide is stopping progress, and it isn't going to get any better. I don't think you will see another moderate for a while.

Agreed

 

[firegiver]

 

[hopefultiger13]

PULEZ

You are doing the FAKE FACTS thing

I come into contact with Russians all the time

Many are temp help on VISA program

Well, you might realize that the Russians in question here are government officials, not exchange students. And if the FBI does a security check on you and you "forget" that you had contact with Russian government officials, you go to jail.

And they aren't FAKE FACTS. EVERY ONE of those meeting is a REAL FACT. I never mentioned the "alleged" meetings and there are a ton of those. Only the meeting that are confirmed by the people in question. Donald Trump Jr HIMSELF, just tweeted the email chain on the meeting.

 

[Willence]

lol at anything that was said on the first page by @Willence @CMTiger15 or @Ron Munson after that email dump by donald trump jr.

What happened has no bearing on what I said. I am not defending Trump. I am pointing out the intellectual dishonesty and pure stupidity of most arguments on this subject.

 

[hopefultiger13]

I'm not saying that this isn't illegal. I just don't understand why it would be. I think as American voters we should know as much as possible about all candidates. Even if that information comes from a foreign government. As long as the information is true why does it matter where it comes from? Hillary was involved in a lot of shady shit over the years in foreign countries. We have a right to know about those things as it effects our lives. For example. When she is accepting massive donations from a country that we are on the verge of war with (Iran). I think the American people should know when something like that occurs. Especially when she is bragging about how good of deal she made with them. Looked more like a good deal for the Clinton Foundation than for the American people.

I like this post and wish I could like it more than once. It shows you actually put some thought into your position instead of simply parroting some pundit.

I'll handle the 2nd part of your post 1st. I'm an independent, not a Dem. While I voted for Hillary, I've got no soft spot for her or Obama. If they did those things, I'm all for investigating them and putting them behind bars. Just because some someone else did something illegal is no defense for you or I doing it. The Trump defense that Hillary or Obama did or didn't do something is total bullshiit. Just like Dems claiming Bush/Cheney did this or that is bullshiit. So if you (and by you, I mean Republicans in general) want to go after past folks for illegal activity I'm down with that completely.

Now to the more complex part of your post. You are assuming that the foreign government is an honest broker of information. If that government had information on both candidates and released all the information they had w/o selectively editing it, I'd agree with you. HOWEVER, if that government wants a certain candidate to win AND they are releasing info on only one candidate (not to mention that this is information developed by that government for the specific purpose of hurting that candidate... is that really trustworthy info?), that's a completely different thing. While I have no problem with full disclosure, but you simply can't allow an unfriendly nation to intentionally try and get the candidate THEY want elected. That's all kinds of bad. It is and should be illegal.

Remember that Russia WANTED Trump elected. They didn't spend a bunch of money collecting dirt on Hillary and working to hack our elections because they wanted to Make America Great Again. They wanted Trump elected b/c they thought it was in their best interests to do so. That means that they believed that President Trump was either good for them or bad for the US or both. That worries me a lot... It doesn't mean that Trump wasn't the best guy for the job... it's just worrisome that an unfriendly nation supports our President and there appears to be a LOT of under the radar meeting with their government.

 

[scotchtiger]

Guys, we already had this thread. We decided that the Russia stuff is shady, but we need to move on to the most critical issues facing our country like tax reform. This is distracting from progress.

 

[orangelvis]

As the apparently lone moderate on the board, I like to ask this question every once in a while.

Remember when Trump told us there were NO CONTACTS between his campaign and the Russians and called all the stories about it fake news. Remember when Spice and Conway said the same thing? Remember when Pence said the same thing? Remember when Donald Trump Jr. blasted the Dems for lying about Trump's campaign contacts? These statements were obviously not true...

So these contacts are confirmed and not fake news:
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Flynn and Manafort actually got paid and are now registered "Agents of Foreign Governments".

Jeff Sessions (Attorney General) met 3 times with the Russian Ambassador (I'm inclined to let this one go as he was a senator at the time... abet a senator that was on Trumps election staff). If this was the only contact within the staff, I'd blow this off. BUT, there's a pattern here.

Rex Tillerson (Sec of State) did tons of business with Gazprom and Rosneft, government controlled energy companies. As with Sessions above, I'm inclined to give him a pass here as well. If this was the only contact within the staff, I'd blow this off. BUT, there's a pattern here.

Carter Page (Trump advisor) met with the Russian Ambassador multiple times as well as owning shares in Gazprom.

Jared K (son-in-law). Stopped by the Russian Embassy and used a secure line to talk to the Russian Government.

Trump Jr. (son). Met with a Russian lawyer to specifically get damaging info on the Clinton campaign (which is CLEARLY ILLEGAL and should have been reported... I see another "Agent of Foreign Government" incoming).

There's more, but they seem pretty sketchy to me...

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Now there's no doubt in my mind that most on here would be going absolutely berserk if this was a Dem problem. Now honestly, I don't care that much that Trump won and Hillary lost. I held my nose and voted Hillary, but, it was like a choice of picking between being gang raped by the crips or the bloods... not much upside either way. But I do care that an unfriendly nation is messing around with our elections AND the current President seems to be very friendly with them. Republicans are usually the ones that are concerned with national security while the Dems drive me crazy with their lovey/dovey politics. While I understand some reluctance to blame your guy and realize that there's no evidence of collusion. But that's a LOT of smoke above for there to be no fire.

Does this not bother you at all?

No. People all over Washington, both Dem and Rep, meet and talk with Russians and other foreign diplomats constantly. In fact, Hillary's people actually set up shop in the Ukraine to try and discredit Trump's campaign. It's no big deal, either way.
Actually, there's never been any real proof that the Russkies hacked the DNC email server.
There is a sure fired way to find out, however. Turn the DNC servers over to the FBI or CIA and let them have a look! Wait! That's right, the DNC refuses to do that. Hmmm.