How did "we" limit free speech. please tell me.
The United States Should Exit NATO. Momentum Building - Europeans Mooching Off American Taxpayer
- Thread starter fatpiggy
- Start date
Democrats need to have a come to Jesus talk with the American people.
We are going to find out a lot about whats been going on with our Governement over the next few months. JFK files. Epstein files. Who knows what else.
No doubt in my mind that both democrats and republicans have been in on the shenanigans. But if Democrats don't start becoming more aware and transparent they are going to wear the brunt of the shock. You can tell the people want the truth. They want authenticity. They want their voices to be heard. If all democrats do is resist, they are going to look like they were the only ones doing wrong.
Democrats are really running the risk of becoming tone deaf. They aren't reading the people. They are used to being able to use the media to get their way, to use the propaganda to push their issues.
They got too comfortable controlling speech. Now that they have to compete on ideas they are listless. Like a sailboat in a storm without a sail.
We are going to find out a lot about whats been going on with our Governement over the next few months. JFK files. Epstein files. Who knows what else.
No doubt in my mind that both democrats and republicans have been in on the shenanigans. But if Democrats don't start becoming more aware and transparent they are going to wear the brunt of the shock. You can tell the people want the truth. They want authenticity. They want their voices to be heard. If all democrats do is resist, they are going to look like they were the only ones doing wrong.
Democrats are really running the risk of becoming tone deaf. They aren't reading the people. They are used to being able to use the media to get their way, to use the propaganda to push their issues.
They got too comfortable controlling speech. Now that they have to compete on ideas they are listless. Like a sailboat in a storm without a sail.
The fact that you are unwilling to see that is the problem.
But it's the democrats problem not mine. Good luck figuring it out. It's not that hard. I have faith in you.
What a bunch of bumbling nonsense. Turn off the computer and start the day over.
If you think i am being dishonest or coming from a place that is not sincere, block me. I don't care Margaret.
I just tell you the truth. Sorry you don't want to hear it.
I think you are coming from a place with a lack of knowledge. I know you think you are telling the truth.
You can't state the problem statement, so therefore no one call solve it. Good luck in your grievances that go on forever due to you not being able to articulate them.
Ok block me. But stop complaining like a 5th grader and make a coherent argument.
Oh we’ve got you rattled now.
You should run off to your twitter safe space and bring back some random posts that make you feel better.
Or if you don’t like it here so much, feel free to move to mother Russia.
You act like other NATO countries don't also contribute their tax dollars, forces and capabilities according to their gdp but they don't demand we follow their cultural norms. Of course we pay more because we're the world's superpower and our gdp is equal to all the NATO countries combined. That in no way is a reason to flip the script and not only abandon them, but become their adversary in order to side with Russia.
I don't want to side with Russia. I want to side with America.
What does America get out of fighting a war for Ukraine? And consider that Ukraine is not in NATO and we have no obligation to defend them.
I would not let my son go fight a war against Ukraine. We would leave the country, or take some other maneuver.
Last edited:
It's like the meme I posted yesterday that said something to the effect of "it's like cancelling your home's security system because no one has broken in yet." We are the only country that invoked article 5 and they stepped up but you want to break with them because you feel safe at the moment and they don't abide by "our" constitutional amendements. That's just fvcking stupid.
Ukraine has no obligation to defend us either but they sent 5000 troops to Afghanistan and spent 14 years there - because they are our friends and that adds value to our country. Isolationism and hubris could be our downfall so let's hope your ideology is defeated before it's too late.
We are crippling our largest economic and military adversary, thats what we are getting out of it.
NATO sent their sons to war when we asked them to fight for us. Or did you forget that?
Our largest economic and military adversary is China and I don't think it's very close?
NATO sent their sons to fight for us when they believed in Freedom of Speech. They no longer hold those same beliefs. It's our first amendment, it's important to us. Democrats also violated the first amendment and look where it got them.
The world changes and that is OK. The NATO members do not value our relationship like they used to as evidenced by their lack of commitment to the agreement. We don't value the relationship like we used to because they no longer have the same values as we do.
Just because something has been that way does not mean it has to continue to be that way. Change is OK.
Fair point.
I think it's also fair to point out that without the USA Ukraine may not exist at all.
They recognize that too and that's why they've stood by our side. The way we're treating them now is disgusting and does not reflect what once made America great.
We aren't adding them as a state. This insistence that they perfectly match our Bill of Rights is strange to me. Assume you support backing off our support of Israel?
I see your point of view from the democratic lens. You all wanted to help Ukraine and view them as an extension of NATO.
The problem is, that the rest of America is in disagreement with you. Not large disagreement, but we have a lot of valid questions and our concerns were dismissed for too long.
So while I understand you viewpoint, i disagree that the way we are treating them now is disgusting. Trump is treating them like a real friends. Real friends help you confront reality and don't run from problems. Real friends don't tell you you have cards when you don't. Real friends don't send your troops into the meat grinder with no hope of ever winning.
We need to question what friendship looks like. How many of your friends try to limit what you can say? How many people do you hang out with where you can't speak your mind? How many send you to fight the bully knowing you are going to get your ass kicked?
Last edited:
Captain Mark Kelly
"I just got back from 36 hours in Ukraine with my brother Scott. Wanted to share a story from while we were there. At a hospital, we talked with a wounded Ukrainian soldier.
I asked him what he thought about the recent change in US policy. His response in English was, “What the ****.”
His name is Anton. He was wounded by a drone attack in Donetsk. He is now blind and is a triple amputee. He lost one arm, the other hand, and one leg. He couldn’t believe what the Trump administration has been doing and saying.
The night before I met Anton, the Donetsk region came under drone attack again. About four months since his injuries. These strikes hit a civilian apartment building killing more than a dozen Ukrainians.
These are war crimes carried out by Russia. It shouldn’t be difficult for anyone to say who the aggressor is in this war. And a President of the United States should see things firsthand. Skip a round of golf and visit Ukraine!
There’s thousands of Ukrainian soldiers just like Anton, fighting to protect their home and their people from Russia’s invasion. But now President Trump is risking each of them and their families to side with the war criminal Putin.
It’s not “America First” to pull the rug out from under an ally and leave their people to die. This kind of foreign policy will end with no one in the world trusting America. Our alliances give us strength and the damage being done makes our country weaker and us all less safe."
Trump being a real friend to anyone is laughable. He uses people for his benefit and then when they don't give him value, he moves on elsewhere.
What you call a Democratic lens is what we used to call an American lens before Trump came along.
Trump has had it out for Zelensky ever since he wouldn't launch a fake investigation into Biden after the "perfect phone call" Trump is transactional and petty and we all know that's the real reason for treating them this way despite your attempts to cover for him by pretending there are other legitimate reasons.
If Trump is treating them the way a real friend would, who needs enemies?
Your arbitrary fixation on free speech, which really means "freedom to lie" doesn't hold water in this situation.
The Lens changes dude.
The American citizen is changing their viewpoint. We have new information and new facts to consider. Things happen, viewpoints change. This is OK.
You are so resistant to change because you were the one in power. The people spoke against you and said you werent doing a good job. Now you have to give the other guys a chance.
There is no arbitrary fixation on free speech.
The Europeans are putting people in jail for speech violations. You don't care because they are speaking out against things you support.
Last edited:
Wait... Are you calling Mark Kelly a traitor?
Are you serious?
Mark Kelly is an American Hero and true Patriot.
Mark Kelly - Wikipedia
Last edited:
And he just went to Ukraine and negotiated against the Presidents stated policy?Wait... Are you calling Mark Kelly a traitor?
Are you serious?
Mark Kelly is an American Hero and true Patriot.
Mark Kelly - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
He visited the country in his role as a representative of the US government.
Also, wasn't Trump talking with Putin before he was president against the current admins policies?
You know that's what the South African called him yesterday, right?Wait... Are you calling Mark Kelly a traitor?
Are you serious?
Mark Kelly is an American Hero and true Patriot.
Mark Kelly - Wikipedia
The only lens that changed is the radical way Trump looks at the world and his thirst for revenge against anyone who he perceives has slighted him, no matter how small or imaginary. Just because magas view everything through the eyes of their orange demi-god doesn't mean that view is healthy for American interests. The people asked for lower inflation, they didn't ask us to smite our friends and abdicate our standing in the world.
They also believe in free speech but don't believe that speech is absolute. If you use speech to inflame hatred and/or violence, you can be prosecuted for it. Is that really so radical? Look what we did to the Columbia student yesterday when he he was arrested for his "free speech."
Well, inflation report is tomorrow morning. We will see if it comes in lower or not. I'm betting it comes in lower than the last report under Biden.
DOGE is deflationary. Tariffs are, in theory, inflationary. Which one will have the bigger effect?
They don't believe in free speech. You can listen to their words and watch their actions. They clearly do not allow speech they disagree with. For example, you can not talk bad about the LQBQTIA+- crowd without being put in jail. Do you deny this is happening? Or do you agree with it because you subscribe to that demented mentality of censorship?
You can't speak about disagreeing with their disastrous immigration policy.
You see, it's the same exact thing that happened here. You guys want to be the arbiter of speech. You dont want speech you disagree with.
It's a large part of why you all don't know that DEI is racism against white people. Because you stifled speech so long people couldn't tell you how wrong you were.
Last edited:
You're tired of it because it isn't a defensible point-of-view.
Putin=Bad
Putin=Russia
Russia=Bad
Well of course our government isn't pure...Trump is in charge.
Based on this we should have no enemies. Are the people of China, North Korea, etc bad people? I don't think so. Are they our enemies? Absolutely, bc of their govt/leaders. I'm no fan of Ukraine, btw, but I don't think Ukrainian people are bad, do you?
Russia invaded a sovereign country who posed no threat to them. That is bad! No way to justify it.
Putin and th3e Russian govt are terrible. That is a completely stand alone idea separate from whether or not Ukraine is good/bad. Defending Russia is lunacy.
I'm not defending Zelensky, but no matter what I think about him, Russia is NOT our friend and is bad. They would wipe us off the map and take our country given the ability and opportunity.
I agree with a lot of what you say and wanted trump to win. Easy choice over Biden. However, everything trump does is not going to be right and trying to justify Russia (invading Ukraine) bc you think Zelensky is wrong is crazy. I don't think Russia or Ukraine are actually our friends and don't care for either govt.
Not addressing all these random statements other than to repeat, their free speech isn't absolute and we have no business telling them how to manage their civilian laws. Consider their history before trying to pretend they should be just like us.
But since we're on the subject, this is an example of what led to one arrest. Do you really have a problem with this?
- For example, a man was jailed for posting on social media calling for hotels housing asylum seekers to be set alight. https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cy76dxkpjpjo
Thanks for the post.
For the record i have never justified Russia's invasion. Only argued it's not our problem because Ukraine is not a NATO country. We have no defense agreement with them.
Also, claiming that the war started soley due to Russia's invasion is a lazy man's argument in my humble opinion.
We don't have any business telling them what laws to have. We do have business in determining what values we defend.
You can't lock up people for speech you disagree with. That is exactly what is happening in Europe.
We no longer share the same values.
They can correct that by releasing the political prisoners if they so choose.
Ignore the arrests at your own peril. Its happening and it's widespread. People from Britain are scared to post their true feelings online. They won't do it. It's a massive problem. Maybe you aren't aware, they probably censor that on BlueSky. Probably because you like censorship because they are censoring things you disagree with.
Last edited:
You are blind if you don't think we are becoming more like them and we may be even worse with Trump's assault on the free press, Dem politicians and law firms he doesn't like, book banning etc...
Similar threads
