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Attack on Israel and intelligence failure

People dying because of religion is beyond old
It's not really a religious struggle anymore it's more about national identity. Israel is trying to stamp out Palestinian national identity and the Palestinians are fighting for it. That's how it is. Of course religion plays a part but it's tertiary I think.
 
It's not really a religious struggle anymore it's more about national identity. Israel is trying to stamp out Palestinian national identity and the Palestinians are fighting for it. That's how it is. Of course religion plays a part but it's tertiary I think.
Both tie their ”national identity” to significant Religious landmarks/territories that they each believe rightfully belong to them as it was ordained by their God.

Sure, perhaps their conflict has transcended purely religious issues, but its still a significant factor and is the reason there was ever a conflict to begin with.
 
Been hearing that for years but this might be the time. Hamas may have just fvcked up.

Something else to think about - Iran might jump into this with Hamas. BUT I think Israel can handle them, mainly because I don’t think Russia is in any position to back them up.

Lots of civilians may die in this but Israel has to hit back hard.
Iran are already helping. Hezbollah also involved at this point who are heavily backed by Iranian money and arms.

This is what Israel are dealing with unfortunately. Hamas does this consistently also.

 
Iran are already helping. Hezbollah also involved at this point who are heavily backed by Iranian money and arms.

This is what Israel are dealing with unfortunately. Hamas does this consistently also.

The whole conflict is beyond redemption. I don’t think you could come up with a more morally ****ed situation.

The descendants of Holocaust survivors engaged in a perpetual cycle of near constant violence with the descendants of the Arab population they evicted from what is now Israel. The worst parts of both groups openly enjoin genocide. Palestinians continue to embrace violence, in the 90s and early 2000s via suicide bombing, now apparently via the open slaughter of soldier and civilian, women and children alike via gunfire and knife. For their part, the Israelis give them little reason not to. There’s not been Gaza-level fighting in the West Bank for decades. It’s not run by Hamas. Hasn’t stopped Israel from choking out any hope of a Palestinian state via illegal annexation and settlement of Jewish people there, the goal being to “change the facts on the ground,” international law and the US be damned. Never mind the hundreds of billions the US has sent to Israel, largely to the delight of the evangelical right that’s utterly silent when Christian pilgrims get spat on in Jerusalem, when Christian cemeteries have their crosses smashed, or when the Church of Loaves and Fish gets burned in an arson attack.

So given standing for Israel or the Palestinians, might be best just to sit down
 
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Hamas is supported /backed by Iran. This is on Joe Biden who has turned over billions of dollars to Iran and no longer following through on sanctions.

We are headed into WW3 with Russia, China, Iran , and North Korea. Russia has invaded Ukraine, Iran backed attacked on Israel, next will be China invading Taiwan....All under Biden's watch .... jmo



I am sure it's Trumps fault..
 
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Hamas is supported /backed by Iran. This is on Joe Biden who has turned over billions of dollars to Iran and no longer following through on sanctions.

We are headed into WW3 with Russia, China, Iran , and North Korea. Russia has invaded Ukraine, Iran backed attacked on Israel, next will be China invading Taiwan....All under Biden's watch .... jmo
And your opinion is stupid. Really should keep it to yourself. And no, I don't have to respect opinions that are utterly uninformed and idiotic.
 
Hamas is supported /backed by Iran. This is on Joe Biden who has turned over billions of dollars to Iran and no longer following through on sanctions.

We are headed into WW3 with Russia, China, Iran , and North Korea. Russia has invaded Ukraine, Iran backed attacked on Israel, next will be China invading Taiwan....All under Biden's watch .... jmo



I am sure it's Trumps fault..
Eh. Trump was largely correct on the Iranian threat but simultaneously had no issue befriending Xi and Kim, not to mention his open adoration of Putin.

Trump and Biden are both wrong in their own way.
 
Still absolutely shocked that an operation of this size was planned beneath the noses of Israel intelligence. No one in Gaza said a peep? There was no sign of rapid mobilization of Hamas/PIJ fighters?

IDF soldiers caught at undermanned outposts and killed before they even got dressed. Probably hundreds of hostages held throughout Gaza now. How the hell does someone fail that badly to protect its own citizens living next to a terrorist run enclave?
 
Eh. Trump was largely correct on the Iranian threat but simultaneously had no issue befriending Xi and Kim, not to mention his open adoration of Putin.

Trump and Biden are both wrong in their own way.

Befriending ? Shouldn't a leader meet with enemies to try to work out differences... But befriending is pushing / spinning it.
 
Still absolutely shocked that an operation of this size was planned beneath the noses of Israel intelligence. No one in Gaza said a peep? There was no sign of rapid mobilization of Hamas/PIJ fighters?

IDF soldiers caught at undermanned outposts and killed before they even got dressed. Probably hundreds of hostages held throughout Gaza now. How the hell does someone fail that badly to protect its own citizens living next to a terrorist run enclave?

Added American hostages to the list ...
 
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Befriending ? Shouldn't a leader meet with enemies to try to work out differences... But befriending is pushing / spinning it.
The idea that Xi/Putin are the type of people you can work out differences with is not one I subscribe to. But that’s an opinion. Bad actors are bad actors.
 
Added American hostages to the list ...
Just saw that too on X. Shitshow. Shouldn't have given up a convicted arms dealer for a basketball player nor sent Iran several billion for the release of a handful of people.
 
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The idea that Xi/Putin are the type of people you can work out differences with is not one I subscribe to. But that’s an opinion. Bad actors are bad actors.
It's not about working out differences it's about doing what's in the best interest of the country
 
Still absolutely shocked that an operation of this size was planned beneath the noses of Israel intelligence. No one in Gaza said a peep? There was no sign of rapid mobilization of Hamas/PIJ fighters?

IDF soldiers caught at undermanned outposts and killed before they even got dressed. Probably hundreds of hostages held throughout Gaza now. How the hell does someone fail that badly to protect its own citizens living next to a terrorist run enclave?

Speaking of intelligence...explain why U.S. government intelligence didn't pick up and stop 911 attacks. These attacks happened from within the country not someone shooting missiles into the country.
 
Speaking of intelligence...explain why U.S. government intelligence didn't pick up and stop 911 attacks. These attacks happened from within the country not someone shooting missiles into the country.
US intelligence was suspicious of at least some of the people involved but seemingly didn't know of a concrete plot.

You're comparing a group of less than 50 hijacking planes in 2001 to a few thousand people storming several military checkpoints of one of the most militarized countries on earth, grabbing several hundred hostages who are now scattered throughout an urban maze of high-rises and tunnels, and launching enough rockets in a short enough period of time to oversaturate an advanced air defense system. What happened yesteday in Israel is considerably worse from an intelligence point of view.
 
US intelligence was suspicious of at least some of the people involved but seemingly didn't know of a concrete plot.

You're comparing a group of less than 50 hijacking planes in 2001 to a few thousand people storming several military checkpoints of one of the most militarized countries on earth, grabbing several hundred hostages who are now scattered throughout an urban maze of high-rises and tunnels, and launching enough rockets in a short enough period of time to oversaturate an advanced air defense system. What happened yesteday in Israel is considerably worse from an intelligence point of view.


Pearl harbor says hello ... I guess it's also not the same . He'll we can't even stop a Chinese surveillance balloon from flying over. But again when Biden and or family receives millions I can see anything happening.
 
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Speaking of intelligence...explain why U.S. government intelligence didn't pick up and stop 911 attacks. These attacks happened from within the country not someone shooting missiles into the country.
There’s actually a pretty good podcast on the topic of all the various 9/11 intelligence failures. Its called the Long Shadow and was turned into a miniseries on Hulu called The Looming Tower.

Short answer is that the FBI and CIA had separate interests, with the FBI, as a law enforcement agency, looking for Al-Qaeda members in order to arrest and prosecute them but the CIA, as an intelligence agency, looking for Al-Qaeda members for the purpose of spying on them and leveraging them for intelligence. So it wasn’t in the CIA’s interest to share info with the FBI and risk a possible intelligence asset being arrested.

Had they shared intelligence, there’s a very strong chance that the US stops 9/11, as the CIA knew of some terrorists that were in the country but never shared those names with the FBI. The FBI knew the names of Al Qaeda members that were involved in a possibly massive attack plan, but didn’t know they were already in the country. Had the CIA just said “hey, there’s this dude in country, his name is so and so” The FBI would have been able to tell them that there was immediate and imminent danger and that these weren’t people to just sit back and spy on.

Lots of other failures around 9/11, including a catastrophic failure of NYC’s emergency communication systems, panic and blind decision making at the white house, and a strong possibility that the Bush administration’s timeline/narrative of events on 9/11 (like the ordering of shooting down passenger planes) was largely falsified.
 
It's not about working out differences it's about doing what's in the best interest of the country
The scary part of this is what happens if Israel feels like they are backed into a corner or don’t have anything else to lose.

Remember, Israel has nuclear weapons.
 
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Pearl harbor says hello ... I guess it's also not the same . He'll we can't even stop a Chinese surveillance balloon from flying over. But again when Biden and or family receives millions I can see anything happening.
I bet if I throw out any random historical events or names, you could somehow tie that to Biden. You're one of the ridiculously ignorant on TI.
 
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So Israel is nuking whom? Be serious.
Potentially Iran. Iran is believed to be behind this, or at least bankrolling it.

I’m not saying they’re gonna do it tomorrow but it is an option.

I’m not saying they’ll nuke the Gaza Strip or the West Bank. They might blow a lot of it up though.
 
Potentially Iran. Iran is believed to be behind this, or at least bankrolling it.

I’m not saying they’re gonna do it tomorrow but it is an option.

I’m not saying they’ll nuke the Gaza Strip or the West Bank. They might blow a lot of it up though.
Hamas and Hezbollah confirmed Iran's backing and green light of the operation. Not surprising given who runs Iran, murderous theocrats who are quite open about their desire to attack Jews. IRGC has its finger prints all over this
 
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Iranian proxies only affect the United States because we're still trying to turn Syria into a liberal democracy TM
Getting this much wrong in the span of a single sentence is almost impressive.
 
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Potentially Iran. Iran is believed to be behind this, or at least bankrolling it.

I’m not saying they’re gonna do it tomorrow but it is an option.

I’m not saying they’ll nuke the Gaza Strip or the West Bank. They might blow a lot of it up though.
Serious question because I really don’t know. Let’s say it got to that point and Israel dropped a nuclear weapon on Iran….what are the consequences of that? Iran doesn’t have nuclear weapons, Saudi Arabia doesn’t, the only “muslim” country that does is Pakistan. Would they retaliate? Would Russia get involved at that point? Or is the consequence just that Iran kind of doesn’t exist anymore? I’m not sure if Israel wiping out Iran isn’t a net positive for the world.
 
Serious question because I really don’t know. Let’s say it got to that point and Israel dropped a nuclear weapon on Iran….what are the consequences of that? Iran doesn’t have nuclear weapons, Saudi Arabia doesn’t, the only “muslim” country that does is Pakistan. Would they retaliate? Would Russia get involved at that point? Or is the consequence just that Iran kind of doesn’t exist anymore? I’m not sure if Israel wiping out Iran isn’t a net positive for the world.
What are they going to nuke in Iran? Hitting a city full of civilians would be idiotic and unjustified. Try to go after Iran's nuclear facilities if possible, but you better be damn sure you can actually take them out. They're beneath mountains.
 
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Serious question because I really don’t know. Let’s say it got to that point and Israel dropped a nuclear weapon on Iran….what are the consequences of that? Iran doesn’t have nuclear weapons, Saudi Arabia doesn’t, the only “muslim” country that does is Pakistan. Would they retaliate? Would Russia get involved at that point? Or is the consequence just that Iran kind of doesn’t exist anymore? I’m not sure if Israel wiping out Iran isn’t a net positive for the world.
It won’t get to that point. Israel could fairly easily accomplish that without the use of nuclear weapons.
 
Serious question because I really don’t know. Let’s say it got to that point and Israel dropped a nuclear weapon on Iran….what are the consequences of that? Iran doesn’t have nuclear weapons, Saudi Arabia doesn’t, the only “muslim” country that does is Pakistan. Would they retaliate? Would Russia get involved at that point? Or is the consequence just that Iran kind of doesn’t exist anymore? I’m not sure if Israel wiping out Iran isn’t a net positive for the world.
Honestly it would be a net positive, though there a lot of Iranians who don’t deserve to be vaporized. I don’t know. But some of the images I’ve seen honestly have me triggered.

The US would never do something like that. But if Israel feels like they have to, I think they will.

This is different than saying I think they WILL nuke Iran.
Where the US comes in is keeping the rest of the ME from jumping in at that point.
What are they going to nuke in Iran? Hitting a city full of civilians would be idiotic and unjustified. Try to go after Iran's nuclear facilities if possible, but you better be damn sure you can actually take them out. They're beneath mountains.
That’s obvious. Target would be Tehran.
 
It won’t get to that point. Israel could fairly easily accomplish that without the use of nuclear weapons.
Russia might back up Iran though. Which makes things complicated.

Which also means it’s in the world’s best interest to keep Ukraine in the fight. Limits the resources Russia has to give Iran.
 
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Honestly it would be a net positive, though there a lot of Iranians who don’t deserve to be vaporized. I don’t know. But some of the images I’ve seen honestly have me triggered.

The US would never do something like that. But if Israel feels like they have to, I think they will.

This is different than saying I think they WILL nuke Iran.
Where the US comes in is keeping the rest of the ME from jumping in at that point.

That’s obvious. Target would be Tehran.
The target for a nuke ?
 
Weird hill to die on on both sides.

Cash in escrow (so-to-speak) might as well be cash in hand--so the "lie" thing is a bit overstated.

Conversely, $6B for a nation-state isn't all that much. In Iran's case, it's around 1.5% of their GDP--so not exactly the thing that funded this atrocity.

Either way, I'd rather we didn't give them squat. It's a bad look no matter how you spin it.
 
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