Free Speech

[scotchtiger]

Whether you agree with Matt Walsh’s “What is a Woman” documentary or not, we should all agree that reasonable speech should not be censored.

TL;DR version: Matt Walsh releases a documentary. Within 20 minutes, Twitter flags it as hateful content and stops retweets, likes and comments. Elon gets tagged and looks into it. Unlocks it in 24 hours and Twitter VP of Trust and Safety “resigns.”

 

[PalmettoTiger1]

Free speech at all costs but not fire in a crowded theater

 

[firegiver]

Whether you agree with Matt Walsh’s “What is a Woman” documentary or not, we should all agree that reasonable speech should not be censored.

TL;DR version: Matt Walsh releases a documentary. Within 20 minutes, Twitter flags it as hateful content and stops retweets, likes and comments. Elon gets tagged and looks into it. Unlocks it in 24 hours and Twitter VP of Trust and Safety “resigns.”

View embedded media

Im always fascinated by this discussion. Here we have a private company, with user agreement and that user agreement has in it rules about posting certain types of content. When that is violated, the system acts as it is intended to. But because this person is famous, they got the way too busy Elon Musk to micro manage his social media empire to allow it, with an exception.

How is this a free speech issue? Free speech is guaranteed as it relates to our government not oppressing it. It says nothing about private companies having to allow free speech. Matt Walsh is using Twitter as a distributor of his content. Its the same as say Walmart not selling his video. Im sure walmart isn't selling it, are they censoring him?

Attributing this to a free speech issue, sounds a bit like manufactured outrage, victim culture.

 

[nytigerfan]

Whether you agree with Matt Walsh’s “What is a Woman” documentary or not, we should all agree that reasonable speech should not be censored.

TL;DR version: Matt Walsh releases a documentary. Within 20 minutes, Twitter flags it as hateful content and stops retweets, likes and comments. Elon gets tagged and looks into it. Unlocks it in 24 hours and Twitter VP of Trust and Safety “resigns.”

View embedded media

Conservatives:
- we are for free speech above all else.

Also conservatives:
- get that son of a bitch Kapernick off of the field!
- ban those books!
- ban all drag shows!

I could go on.

 

[firegiver]

Conservatives:
- we are for free speech above all else.

Also conservatives:
- get that son of a bitch Kapernick off of the field!
- ban those books!
- ban all drag shows!

I could go on.

yah i thought about pointing out Kapernick, but whats the point.

 

[scotchtiger]

Im always fascinated by this discussion. Here we have a private company, with user agreement and that user agreement has in it rules about posting certain types of content. When that is violated, the system acts as it is intended to. But because this person is famous, they got the way too busy Elon Musk to micro manage his social media empire to allow it, with an exception.

How is this a free speech issue? Free speech is guaranteed as it relates to our government not oppressing it. It says nothing about private companies having to allow free speech. Matt Walsh is using Twitter as a distributor of his content. Its the same as say Walmart not selling his video. Im sure walmart isn't selling it, are they censoring him?

Attributing this to a free speech issue, sounds a bit like manufactured outrage, victim culture.

It’s an interesting discussion. On one hand, private companies absolutely have the right to allow or disallow whatever they want. On the other, you have a few private companies that control an outsized portion of national news and narrative. When those companies use political bias to censor opposing viewpoints, while within their rights, it hurts the nation.

Anyways, glad Elon owns Twitter now so he can rid his company of these activists.

 

[firegiver]

It’s an interesting discussion. On one hand, private companies absolutely have the right to allow or disallow whatever they want. On the other, you have a few private companies that control an outsized portion of national news and narrative. When those companies use political bias to censor opposing viewpoints, while within their rights, it hurts the nation.

Anyways, glad Elon owns Twitter now so he can rid his company of these activists.

Eh? Elon's company oppresses 'speech' all the time. But because its Matt Walsh, who i despise and you like, its ok?

What we have here is the reveal for why Elon bought Twitter. He wants to control the narrative. Now you can say you are happy NOW with this particular decision. What happens if he starts taking ketamine with Joe Rogan and becomes woke, whatever that means? You going to be ok with this arrangement?

We are dancing around the real issue: Should the internet be considered a utility and regulated by the government. Same as the telephone and electric grid. You want mandated free speech on the internet? Thats how you get it.

 

[dpic73]

It’s an interesting discussion. On one hand, private companies absolutely have the right to allow or disallow whatever they want. On the other, you have a few private companies that control an outsized portion of national news and narrative. When those companies use political bias to censor opposing viewpoints, while within their rights, it hurts the nation.

Anyways, glad Elon owns Twitter now so he can rid his company of these activists.

Yeah, it's great as long as the people being censored have viewpoints different from yours. He's already run off multiple well-known celebrities and experts in their field by taking away their blue checks and now many liberal accounts only work sporadically. Freedumb

Elon Musk’s Twitter Is Suspending Liberal Accounts for “Spam”

Several major Twitter accounts have been suspended or had other issues on the platform.

newrepublic.com

 

[TigerGrowls]

Yeah, it's great as long as the people being censored have viewpoints different from yours. He's already run off multiple well-known celebrities and experts in their field by taking away their blue checks and now many liberal accounts only work sporadically. Freedumb

Elon Musk’s Twitter Is Suspending Liberal Accounts for “Spam”

Several major Twitter accounts have been suspended or had other issues on the platform.

newrepublic.com

View embedded media

These well known celebs left without even being censored at all. They left to protest twitter allowing conservatives back on the platform so don't even feed us this crap.

 

[dpic73]

These well known celebs left without even being censored at all. They left to protest twitter allowing conservatives back on the platform so don't even feed us this crap.

Bullshit, they left because now you cellar dwellers can impersonate them and there's nothing they can do about it.

 

[TigerGrowls]

Bullshit, they left because now you cellar dwellers can impersonate them and there's nothing they can do about it.

LOL!!!

 

[dbjork6317]

It’s an interesting discussion. On one hand, private companies absolutely have the right to allow or disallow whatever they want. On the other, you have a few private companies that control an outsized portion of national news and narrative. When those companies use political bias to censor opposing viewpoints, while within their rights, it hurts the nation.

Anyways, glad Elon owns Twitter now so he can rid his company of these activists.

You have a few private companies that control an outsized portion of the wealth. When those companies use that wealth to influence politicians and government policies, while within their rights, it hurts the nation.

 

[OleFastball]

Im always fascinated by this discussion. Here we have a private company, with user agreement and that user agreement has in it rules about posting certain types of content. When that is violated, the system acts as it is intended to. But because this person is famous, they got the way too busy Elon Musk to micro manage his social media empire to allow it, with an exception.

How is this a free speech issue? Free speech is guaranteed as it relates to our government not oppressing it. It says nothing about private companies having to allow free speech. Matt Walsh is using Twitter as a distributor of his content. Its the same as say Walmart not selling his video. Im sure walmart isn't selling it, are they censoring him?

Attributing this to a free speech issue, sounds a bit like manufactured outrage, victim culture.

Twitter files. Have you read them?

 

[OleFastball]

Conservatives:
- we are for free speech above all else.

Also conservatives:
- get that son of a bitch Kapernick off of the field!
- ban those books!
- ban all drag shows!

I could go on.

Which book is banned?

 

[dpic73]

Which book is banned?

Stop trying to move the goalposts. Just because you can get the book on Amazon distracts from the fact that the books are banned in school libraries where they would be most accessible to school children. There are millions of children who can't afford to buy the books that end up on these lists that are banned due to a minority of Karens who think they have the right to decide what's right for all children.

These 176 Books Were Banned in Duval County, Florida

PEN America and We Need Diverse Books are calling attention to 176 banned books that Duval, County, Florida removed from classroom libraries in January 2022 for “review,” and kept in storage.

pen.org

 

[OleFastball]

So they were moved out of the classroom due to being inappropriate. That is not a ban any more than Saying there is a ban on alcohol because children can’t buy it.

We regulate many things for children and that now includes inappropriate books.

There is no book ban. If you say there is a book ban then you must agree that there is an alcohol ban, there is a ban on voting, and there are bans on driving. It’s a stupid argument.

 

[PalmettoTiger1]

Conservatives:
- we are for free speech above all else.

Also conservatives:
- get that son of a bitch Kapernick off of the field!
- ban those books!
- ban all drag shows!

I could go on.

My response for example on Kapernick is your employer calls the shots Kapernick does not

Kapernick get off the field as the people paying for the tickets don't want to see U seeking attention

Kapernick can talk all he wants to right now No one is stopping him Just pay your money and stage to do it

Ban books is always subjective i the sense age appropriate or content appropriate

Books telling people how to murder people , build bombs , rob banks , commit treason , make up phony Russian collusion hoaxes etc There is a line in the sand

Drag shows I am OK with anyone privately wanting to pay the bill to have them but on the public payroll I don't see a value in having them or in schools with young children

Let me suggest that the next step based on where you are going is to have pedophiles in school as counselors instructing children how to get in touch with them without the parents knowing

I am for free speech but gain careful as to the extreme limits

 

[scotchtiger]

Yeah, it's great as long as the people being censored have viewpoints different from yours. He's already run off multiple well-known celebrities and experts in their field by taking away their blue checks and now many liberal accounts only work sporadically. Freedumb

Elon Musk’s Twitter Is Suspending Liberal Accounts for “Spam”

Several major Twitter accounts have been suspended or had other issues on the platform.

newrepublic.com

View embedded media

I’m not for censoring anyone. It’s pretty well-established at this point that there was activism within Twitter and very intentional censoring of people on the right.

I don’t get on Twitter other than to read the occasional linked tweet, but is there now an established pattern of censorship of the left? Or is it more balanced than before?

 

[scotchtiger]

Eh? Elon's company oppresses 'speech' all the time. But because its Matt Walsh, who i despise and you like, its ok?

What we have here is the reveal for why Elon bought Twitter. He wants to control the narrative. Now you can say you are happy NOW with this particular decision. What happens if he starts taking ketamine with Joe Rogan and becomes woke, whatever that means? You going to be ok with this arrangement?

We are dancing around the real issue: Should the internet be considered a utility and regulated by the government. Same as the telephone and electric grid. You want mandated free speech on the internet? Thats how you get it.

I don’t know enough about Matt Walsh to have an opinion. This video is probably the first content of his that Ive seen, and I skimmed for 10 minutes.

But it’s not hate speech, which is how Twitter flagged it. So a wrong was righted by Elon. That’s not controlling the narrative, it’s just the right thing to do.

 

[dpic73]

So they were moved out of the classroom due to being inappropriate. That is not a ban any more than Saying there is a ban on alcohol because children can’t buy it.

We regulate many things for children and that now includes inappropriate books.

There is no book ban. If you say there is a book ban then you must agree that there is an alcohol ban, there is a ban on voting, and there are bans on driving. It’s a stupid argument.

Who decides what's appropriate for all children? Should a small group of red state parents get to decide what other children can read? Some of the books that are being threatened are classics that have been in libraries for decades but now that we have this fake culture war crusade, the Right has decided to fearmonger the issue in order to get books removed that might encourage children to have empathy with others. Stop trying to impose minority rule on the rest of the world - you don't own it!

 

[scotchtiger]

Who decides what's appropriate for all children? Should a small group of red state parents get to decide what other children can read? Some of the books that are being threatened are classics that have been in libraries for decades but now that we have this fake culture war crusade, the Right has decided to fearmonger the issue in order to get books removed that might encourage children to have empathy with others. Stop trying to impose minority rule on the rest of the world - you don't own it!

It’s a fair discussion to be had. There was a post on here the other day and a mother read a passage from a book in her child’s library that spoke of a man sexually abusing young girls with detail about why he thought it was the right thing to do.

Let’s just all agree that book should be removed from a school library….

But then where do you draw the line? I think the right has overreached, but the general concept of removing inappropriate content from children’s libraries isn’t wrong unto itself.

 

[firegiver]

I don’t know enough about Matt Walsh to have an opinion. This video is probably the first content of his that Ive seen, and I skimmed for 10 minutes.

But it’s not hate speech, which is how Twitter flagged it. So a wrong was righted by Elon. That’s not controlling the narrative, it’s just the right thing to do.

You might want to do more than skim before you declare. Truth is I haven't watched it. But that guy is a known hate monger. He's gross

Either way I m a purist in that I agree on the principles of free speech. When the freedom of information act was up I was for it. Conservatives torpedoed it and now they bemoan private companies making policies that are profitable which includes limiting hate speech. They may go forward with many other limitations just because advertisers don't like it.

You've avoided my point though. Twitter suppresses lots of content. Do you want that stopped?

 

[dbjork6317]

I don’t know enough about Matt Walsh to have an opinion. This video is probably the first content of his that Ive seen, and I skimmed for 10 minutes.

But it’s not hate speech, which is how Twitter flagged it. So a wrong was righted by Elon. That’s not controlling the narrative, it’s just the right thing to do.

Walsh is just another right wing troll who uses twitter and other media platforms to make a name for himself by saying purposefully incendiary things. He literally refers to himself as a “theocratic fascist” and has expressed support for Uganda’s new LGBT law that includes 20 year prison sentences and even the death penalty for homosexuality.

 

[OleFastball]

Who decides what's appropriate for all children? Should a small group of red state parents get to decide what other children can read? Some of the books that are being threatened are classics that have been in libraries for decades but now that we have this fake culture war crusade, the Right has decided to fearmonger the issue in order to get books removed that might encourage children to have empathy with others. Stop trying to impose minority rule on the rest of the world - you don't own it!

How do we decide what age to regulate alcohol? Drivers licenses? Cigarettes? Voting?

We can argue about which books should be in which schools etc. but there is no argument that books are banned. It’s simply untrue.

Now, I may agree with you that some of those books should remain in school, but that can be negotiated the same way we negotiate other regulations.

And interesting that a “fake culture war” got 170mm views this weekend. Seems a lot of people disagree with your assessment.

 

[OleFastball]

You might want to do more than skim before you declare. Truth is I haven't watched it. But that guy is a known hate monger. He's gross

Either way I m a purist in that I agree on the principles of free speech. When the freedom of information act was up I was for it. Conservatives torpedoed it and now they bemoan private companies making policies that are profitable which includes limiting hate speech. They may go forward with many other limitations just because advertisers don't like it.

You've avoided my point though. Twitter suppresses lots of content. Do you want that stopped?

Less hate speech than ever on twiiter.

The difference between how twitter suppresses and other social media outlets is that Twitter admits it and shows you exactly how they are doing it. Other social media sites deny it or keep their bias hidden as if they are the arbiter of truth.

And it’s impossible to show every tweet or post. So there is always going to be some bias in what you are shown. At least Twitter shows you exactly how they do it.

 

[dbjork6317]

It’s a fair discussion to be had. There was a post on here the other day and a mother read a passage from a book in her child’s library that spoke of a man sexually abusing young girls with detail about why he thought it was the right thing to do.

Let’s just all agree that book should be removed from a school library….

But then where do you draw the line? I think the right has overreached, but the general concept of removing inappropriate content from children’s libraries isn’t wrong unto itself.

I think the clear issue with what conservatives are doing regarding books in schools is that they’re taking a few examples of books that, sure, probably many people could reasonably agree aren’t age appropriate for children and then lumping in lots and lots of other books that are age appropriate that just deal with themes that conservatives don’t like - namely, racism.

If you look at the books that were removed in Duval County, some of them are just biographies on people like Harriet Tubman and Rosa Parks and Hank Aaron. These are children’s books, by the way, illustration books.

There’s a concerted effort to remove books that deal with racism in America’s history or even acknowledge the existence of gay people under the guise of removing a handful of books with sexually explicit language.

 

[dpic73]

How do we decide what age to regulate alcohol? Drivers licenses? Cigarettes? Voting?

We can argue about which books should be in which schools etc. but there is no argument that books are banned. It’s simply untrue.

Now, I may agree with you that some of those books should remain in school, but that can be negotiated the same way we negotiate other regulations.

And interesting that a “fake culture war” got 170mm views this weekend. Seems a lot of people disagree with your assessment.

Who do you think Gen Z will listen to - Matt Walsh or Taylor Swift?



"Taylor Swift urges fans to hold lawmakers accountable in the voting booth amid ongoing anti-queer legislation in the US: “We can’t talk about Pride without talking about pain. Right now and recently there have been so many harmful pieces of legislation that have put people in the LGBTQ+ and queer community at risk. It’s painful for everyone. Every ally. Every loved one. Every person in these communities. And that’s why I’m always posting, ‘This is when the midterms are. This is when these important key primaries are.’ We can support as much as we want during Pride Month, but if we’re not doing our research on these elected officials, are they actually advocates? Are they allies? Are they protectors of equality? Do I want to vote for them"

 

[dbjork6317]

I’m not for censoring anyone. It’s pretty well-established at this point that there was activism within Twitter and very intentional censoring of people on the right.

Who on the right was censored on twitter? I’m aware of them removing tweets and accounts of those who tweeted out false information, especially regarding the 2020 election results, but I’m not aware of twitter censoring people on the right beyond that.

 

[OleFastball]

Who on the right was censored on twitter? I’m aware of them removing tweets and accounts of those who tweeted out false information, especially regarding the 2020 election results, but I’m not aware of twitter censoring people on the right beyond that.

Twitter 1.0 or Twitter 2.0?

If you are speaking of Twitter 1.0 just read the Twitter files.

 

[OleFastball]

Who do you think Gen Z will listen to - Matt Walsh or Taylor Swift?

View embedded media

"Taylor Swift urges fans to hold lawmakers accountable in the voting booth amid ongoing anti-queer legislation in the US: “We can’t talk about Pride without talking about pain. Right now and recently there have been so many harmful pieces of legislation that have put people in the LGBTQ+ and queer community at risk. It’s painful for everyone. Every ally. Every loved one. Every person in these communities. And that’s why I’m always posting, ‘This is when the midterms are. This is when these important key primaries are.’ We can support as much as we want during Pride Month, but if we’re not doing our research on these elected officials, are they actually advocates? Are they allies? Are they protectors of equality? Do I want to vote for them"

I like a lot of entertainers that i think have horrible politics. Wtf would anyone listen to a celebrity for their political opinions?

 

[dpic73]

I like a lot of entertainers that i think have horrible politics. Wtf would anyone listen to a celebrity for their political opinions?

You seem to be pretty hyped that pseudo-celebrity Walsh got a lot of views on that video. Why would anyone listen to him?

 

[scotchtiger]

I think the clear issue with what conservatives are doing regarding books in schools is that they’re taking a few examples of books that, sure, probably many people could reasonably agree aren’t age appropriate for children and then lumping in lots and lots of other books that are age appropriate that just deal with themes that conservatives don’t like - namely, racism.

If you look at the books that were removed in Duval County, some of them are just biographies on people like Harriet Tubman and Rosa Parks and Hank Aaron. These are children’s books, by the way, illustration books.

There’s a concerted effort to remove books that deal with racism in America’s history or even acknowledge the existence of gay people under the guise of removing a handful of books with sexually explicit language.

I generally agree. As I said, the right has overreached. I understand why many people feel that the topic of racism has been overplayed, but removing books that address it isn’t the answer.

 

[nytigerfan]

I like a lot of entertainers that i think have horrible politics. Wtf would anyone listen to a celebrity for their political opinions?

Why would anyone listen to a celebrity? Even worse, why would anyone worship a reality game show host and believe that very lie that comes out of his mouth?

 

[TigerGrowls]

Who on the right was censored on twitter? I’m aware of them removing tweets and accounts of those who tweeted out false information, especially regarding the 2020 election results, but I’m not aware of twitter censoring people on the right beyond that.

Stuck your head in the sand literally if you missed it. Come on man!

 

[PalmettoTiger1]

Stuck your head in the sand literally if you missed it. Come on man!

To say that Twitter under former management did not censor speech is hilarious and the person saying that lives in another basement world

For someone to even say that makes me say there is no hope to talk to people that incredible blind to reality

 

[WapPride]

Twitter files. Have you read them?

Ooooooof

 

[yoshi121374]

View embedded media

Ooooooof

Don't say bad things about Musk. He and Community notes were supposed to fix everything. Sadly, every part of Twitter that he's touched so far has been a disaster. Spaces is off to a roaring success isn't it Ron Desantis?

 

[DW4_2016]

Which book is banned?

In some places, the Bible amongst many other books which were burned by conservatives

 

[OleFastball]

They hate Elon because they can't control him

 

[OleFastball]