My wife’s aunt just passed away due to covid

[Larry_Williams]

People see what they want to see right now. It’s amazing that so many of us look for reinforcement for our beliefs rather than looking for information about them to support/refute our own tenets.

A friend of mine put it perfectly the other day:

The intelligent arguments of either side are routinely pitted against the worst arguments of either side. We've somehow lost the entire art of debate. Could you win a debate over someone else while taking the opposite stance of what you believe in? Why is that important? It's not about the ability to manipulate. It's about the ability to see all sides of an issue and get to the core of what is going on. That's what makes someone great at debates. Otherwise, we sit on our side, drinking beer, and cheer the people attacking the straw men in the field in front of us.

 

[Gruntmaster]

I wear one at work and that’s it, not because I’m defiant, but because of long term health issues of wearing one. The suppression of your immune system and respiratory issues scares me more then the virus. Breathing in your CO2 and not being able to expel unhealthy bacteria ain’t good. I do respect social distancing though.

 

[ForzaTigre]

What was false about what I said?

I am not militantly against being careful at all.

 

[Larry_Williams]

I am not militantly against being careful at all.

I didn't say you are.

I think a significant percentage of people who are militantly against wearing masks are also militantly against being careful because they don't even think this thing exists.

 

[lightsoutd]

I wear one for work, because it is mandatory. If it were not mandatory, I would wear one anyway to protect my customers that are in their homes. When I go out into public, on my own time, I do not wear one. If you are vulnerable and go into public, that is on you. There are plenty of services available whereby you can have all of your needs delivered to you. If you are scared of the virus, stay home, then you will not have to worry about beating people up that are not wearing a mask!

 

[tigergrad03]

I told you where I’ll be. You can pick the nearest Wells Fargo if you want a home turf advantage. I’ll twist your ass into a pretzel. I’ll even bring the mustard.

OP so sorry to hear about your aunt. May God give you and your family peace in these difficult times. His plan is flawless and your aunt is in His Kingdom today.

@DaBadass Man there was a time in my life when I might have said something like this. As the years have passed I’ve become much wiser and realize in a split second all of your “ill twist you into a pretzel” can and likely would be over. In South Carolina it’s referred to as stand your ground and self defense. There are millions that are armed and while many wouldn’t know how to effectively use it they can still end the threat rather quickly. For those of us who do know how it will be over in a half second. Calling people out to where you either work or otherwise in today’s society is begging for trouble. You’re screen name I suppose tells me all I need to know. But if you’re blessed to live long enough your way of seeing things will likely change. I sincerely hope so. I’m not trying be combative just thought I’d drop this here. I was once just like you. It is a very unwise way of being now days in particular

 

[nytigerfan]

My guess it goes beyond the mask and a significant number of them are militantly against being careful at all.

I'm 45, and the chances of my dying from this are probably extremely low.

But the chances of my being wiped out for a week or two and being in the hospital and/or having to be on oxygen? Quite a bit higher. I'm trying my best to avoid that.

Very well put. Everyone focuses on death rate only. Have had some friends go through this - 40s, very healthy - and it is no joke. Then there is also the hospital bill. Some guy just got released and handed a $1.1 mm bill.

 

[ChicagoTiger85]

So sorry for the lost man.

As someone in healthcare, I can promise you the odds of her catching covid if she was wearing a mask in public and someone else wasn’t is extremely unlikely unless she was in highly congested areas. Though a mask is important, it won’t protect you from the many other touch points you have just being a human and interacting with society.

But what are the chances of catching it if both people are wearing a mask? The answer is: almost zero. The resistance to mask wearing is kind of bizarre.

 

[DClemsonTiger]

But what are the chances of catching it if both people are wearing a mask? The answer is: almost zero. The resistance to mask wearing is kind of bizarre.

It really is the no-brainer, super low life-impairment answer to this.

 

[Larry_Williams]

Very well put. Everyone focuses on death rate only. Have had some friends go through this - 40s, very healthy - and it is no joke. Then there is also the hospital bill. Some guy just got released and handed a $1.1 mm bill.

Wow.

A friend of mine in Charleston works in an office with six people. Four of the six are sick (104 temp, etc) and he fears he has it.

In another example, a friend of a friend just came out of a weeks-long struggle with it. Lost 30 pounds. Is an ex-Marine, 40 years old and in impeccable shape. Said he'd rather go back to boot camp at Parris Island than deal with that again.

I totally get that the death rate is a major factor as we evaluate ending shutdowns, keeping our country semi-functioning, etc.

But if people are using that death rate to explain away living as they always have and thumbing their nose at the virus as something that is a major deal only for old people and people with pre-existing conditions, some of them are going to be in for a very rude awakening when they or people close to them get this.

 

[ChicagoTiger85]

My guess it goes beyond the mask and a significant number of them are militantly against being careful at all.

I'm 45, and the chances of my dying from this are probably extremely low.

But the chances of my being wiped out for a week or two and being in the hospital and/or having to be on oxygen? Quite a bit higher. I'm trying my best to avoid that.

You’re exactly right.

In Northern Va, nearly everybody wears masks indoors.

@lightsoutd , don’t you think it would be nice for “vulnerable people” to also be able to get out and do things? What if you could make it safer for everyone by wearing a mask indoors in public or when you can’t social distance, just until the infection rate drops way down or until there a good treatment or a vaccine?

 

[ChicagoTiger85]

I wear one at work and that’s it, not because I’m defiant, but because of long term health issues of wearing one. The suppression of your immune system and respiratory issues scares me more then the virus. Breathing in your CO2 and not being able to expel unhealthy bacteria ain’t good. I do respect social distancing though.

I don’t buy this at all. This sounds like looking for justification for something you already wanted to do. None of those things are going to happen to you because you wore a mask for a few minutes in a store.

 

[Caltigers]

Wow.

A friend of mine in Charleston works in an office with six people. Four of the six are sick (104 temp, etc) and he fears he has it.

In another example, a friend of a friend just came out of a weeks-long struggle with it. Lost 30 pounds. Is an ex-Marine, 40 years old and in impeccable shape. Said he'd rather go back to boot camp at Parris Island than deal with that again.

I totally get that the death rate is a major factor as we evaluate ending shutdowns, keeping our country semi-functioning, etc.

But if people are using that death rate to explain away living as they always have and thumbing their nose at the virus as something that is a major deal only for old people and people with pre-existing conditions, some of them are going to be in for a very rude awakening when they or people close to them get this.

Same thing with myself as well. Coworker in his mid 40's just had it. Was intubated for 6 weeks, lost almost 60lbs. and currently in his 2nd week at a PT facility gaining strength to walk and use his hands again. He is lucky to be alive.

 

[ChicagoTiger85]

Same thing with myself as well. Coworker in his mid 40's just had it. Was intubated for 6 weeks, lost almost 60lbs. and currently in his 2nd week at a PT facility gaining strength to walk and use his hands again. He is lucky to be alive.

I know of two teenage brothers who had to be intubated and put on ECMO for over a month. Both have been weaned off the machines, but neither are fully recovered at this point and it’s been close to two months.

 

[Larry_Williams]

Same thing with myself as well. Coworker in his mid 40's just had it. Was intubated for 6 weeks, lost almost 60lbs. and currently in his 2nd week at a PT facility gaining strength to walk and use his hands again. He is lucky to be alive.

Holy smokes.

 

[tigergrad03]

My guess it goes beyond the mask and a significant number of them are militantly against being careful at all.

I'm 45, and the chances of my dying from this are probably extremely low.

But the chances of my being wiped out for a week or two and being in the hospital and/or having to be on oxygen? Quite a bit higher. I'm trying my best to avoid that.

My guess it goes beyond the mask and a significant number of them are militantly against being careful at all.

I'm 45, and the chances of my dying from this are probably extremely low.

But the chances of my being wiped out for a week or two and being in the hospital and/or having to be on oxygen? Quite a bit higher. I'm trying my best to avoid that.

Larry,

I agree with everything you have stated. That’s been my general point of view from the beginning. From the beginning being significant. Remember back when this started. For the first 2 months or so no one was wearing a mask. I asked my wife why in the world are they (media) not mentioning a mask at all. I understand at that time their were likely shortages for PPE at hospitals due to China hoarding the resources. But at that time the only two things they discussed to my knowledge were stay 6 feet apart and wash your hands more. This being when it was peaking from what they said. And I never saw a single media source wearing a mask. The narrative changed and then it’s wear a mask but wait don’t wear a mask because it doesn’t work. Even to the degree some said it can infect you through your eyes. Which is very possible. My point being how can we know what to believe? It’s a personal choice all have to make. I don’t fault it either way. When all the protest, looting and violence started its was an absolute guarantee the next story would be the virus is now spiking again. When the protest started for a week they didn’t say a word about the virus. It was added back to the conversation as people got tired of watching and listening to nothing but insanity.

 

[KingBMich]

A friend of mine put it perfectly the other day:

The intelligent arguments of either side are routinely pitted against the worst arguments of either side. We've somehow lost the entire art of debate. Could you win a debate over someone else while taking the opposite stance of what you believe in? Why is that important? It's not about the ability to manipulate. It's about the ability to see all sides of an issue and get to the core of what is going on. That's what makes someone great at debates. Otherwise, we sit on our side, drinking beer, and cheer the people attacking the straw men in the field in front of us.

Debate only further entrenches people into their original stance.

 

[acwill07]

False. I don’t wear a mask and I’m not going to do so no matter where I go or what I do but at the same time I am not in public much. I go to the grocery store once a week, play golf and go out to restaurants. That’s the extent of me being out. I keep my distance from everyone who is not my family or close friends.

I’m not wearing a mask because wearing one is not going to make this virus suddenly disappear. The virus is here to stay. We need to learn how to live with it as a society.

That’s not a very good reason. You may as well have just said that you aren’t gonna wear one cause you don’t feel like it. Not wearing one in public is selfish.

 

[Gruntmaster]

I don’t buy this at all. This sounds like looking for justification for something you already wanted to do. None of those things are going to happen to you because you wore a mask for a few minutes in a store.

I don’t care what you buy because it is a fact those side effects happen. I also said long term but you typically cherry picked my post.

 

[ChicagoTiger85]

I don’t care what you buy because it is a fact those side effects happen. I also said long term but you typically cherry picked my post.

When are you wearing the mask long term in public? Why would you not wear the mask in public because of “long-term” effects are unlikely?

 

[Gruntmaster]

When are you wearing the mask long term in public? Why would you not wear the mask in public because of “long-term” effects are unlikely?

I do at work for hours in the day, so that’s enough for me.

 

[ChicagoTiger85]

I do at work for hours in the day, so that’s enough for me.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/victor...s-will-not-give-you-carbon-dioxide-poisoning/

 

[CU91ENGR]

Larry,

I agree with everything you have stated. That’s been my general point of view from the beginning. From the beginning being significant. Remember back when this started. For the first 2 months or so no one was wearing a mask. I asked my wife why in the world are they (media) not mentioning a mask at all. I understand at that time their were likely shortages for PPE at hospitals due to China hoarding the resources. But at that time the only two things they discussed to my knowledge were stay 6 feet apart and wash your hands more. This being when it was peaking from what they said. And I never saw a single media source wearing a mask. The narrative changed and then it’s wear a mask but wait don’t wear a mask because it doesn’t work. Even to the degree some said it can infect you through your eyes. Which is very possible. My point being how can we know what to believe? It’s a personal choice all have to make. I don’t fault it either way. When all the protest, looting and violence started its was an absolute guarantee the next story would be the virus is now spiking again. When the protest started for a week they didn’t say a word about the virus. It was added back to the conversation as people got tired of watching and listening to nothing but insanity.

At first CDC said that wearing a mask was not a benefit. Then when they switched their view, the media made it a point to show it. This isn't some conspiracy.

 

[clemben]

I don’t care what you buy because it is a fact those side effects happen. I also said long term but you typically cherry picked my post.

So all the doctors, nurses, health care professionals who wear these all day (and not cloth masks but real N95 masks with seals) are hurting their health by wearing masks for long hours for years and years, every day? Smh...

Your argument doesn't pass a basic logic test but also doesn't hold up with scientific scrutiny: https://www.forbes.com/sites/victor...l-not-weaken-your-immune-system/#39c96617b88f

 

[kwazii]

I don’t care what you buy because it is a fact those side effects happen. I also said long term but you typically cherry picked my post.

Your claims are 100% pseudo science. Not true at all. MD here who spends most days wearing a level 3 surgical mask.

 

[tigergrad03]

At first CDC said that wearing a mask was not a benefit. Then when they switched their view, the media made it a point to show it. This isn't some conspiracy.

Have you ever wondered given it seems like common sense, that is wearing a mask, how the CDC of all places could or would “switch” their view on such a thing? I mean would the Center for Disease Control not know for a certainty from the beginning that wearing a mask is either beneficial or not? If not that seems like gross incompetence at best.

 

[clemben]

At first CDC said that wearing a mask was not a benefit. Then when they switched their view, the media made it a point to show it. This isn't some conspiracy.

And the CDC had a point. Mask wearing in the US is way behind other countries, esp Asian countries where it is already a custom to wear them in public if you feel sick (part of the culture of going to work no matter what) and they wear full-on, real N95 masks. Cloth masks if only worn by a few people in public really only reduce your chances of contracting the virus a little bit and may make you touch your face even more. Now if everyone wears a mask, that makes a huge difference and if the spread is from droplets (basically aerosol spit) then it makes a big difference too.

I think the initial CDC rec was clumsy but get why they did it.

Have you ever wondered given it seems like common sense, that is wearing a mask, how the CDC of all places could or would “switch” their view on such a thing? I mean would the Center for Disease Control not know for a certainty from the beginning that wearing a mask is either beneficial or not? If not that seems like gross incompetence at best.

Got you covered above @tigergrad03

 

[JAMCRACKER99]

Edit: deleted by poster

Please wear a mask.

I'm so sorry for your loss. Basic human decency has apparently gone out the window with some people on this board.

 

[Tigerden]

Very sorry. God Bless.

 

[acwill07]

Unless you're rioting or looting...

Those people should just be shot...we’d be better off without looters, with or without masks.

 

[dbjork6317]

Well that’s stupid and selfish. Wearing a mask is so easy and it helps to protect the vulnerable. What’s the issue?

It’s simple: there’s an entire generation of people that have never had to sacrifice anything for the greater good and were raised in an era of fierce individualism and they’ve become so entitled that they simply won’t abide even the tiniest of inconveniences. These people stood outside and protested with signs like “I need a haircut.” Yet now they roll their eyes at people protesting with signs like “stop killing people”

 

[DaBadass]

OP so sorry to hear about your aunt. May God give you and your family peace in these difficult times. His plan is flawless and your aunt is in His Kingdom today.

@DaBadass Man there was a time in my life when I might have said something like this. As the years have passed I’ve become much wiser and realize in a split second all of your “ill twist you into a pretzel” can and likely would be over. In South Carolina it’s referred to as stand your ground and self defense. There are millions that are armed and while many wouldn’t know how to effectively use it they can still end the threat rather quickly. For those of us who do know how it will be over in a half second. Calling people out to where you either work or otherwise in today’s society is begging for trouble. You’re screen name I suppose tells me all I need to know. But if you’re blessed to live long enough your way of seeing things will likely change. I sincerely hope so. I’m not trying be combative just thought I’d drop this here. I was once just like you. It is a very unwise way of being now days in particular

This is a long way of humble bragging that you are skilled with a weapon and could kill me in a second while also saying that you’ve changed. You are really talking to yourself through this half cocked, logically flawed attempt at imparting wisdom. Whose work did you show up to after getting in an argument on a message board? Call your anger management instructor and try to get your money back. Probably won’t be able to if it was court mandated.

 

[acwill07]

This is a long way of humble bragging that you are skilled with a weapon and could kill me in a second while also saying that you’ve changed. You are really talking to yourself through this half cocked, logically flawed attempt at imparting wisdom. Whose work did you show up to after getting in an argument on a message board? Call your anger management instructor and try to get your money back. Probably won’t be able to if it was court mandated.

That guy has been posting weird stuff for a few days now.

 

[tigergrad03]

This is a long way of humble bragging that you are skilled with a weapon and could kill me in a second while also saying that you’ve changed. You are really talking to yourself through this half cocked, logically flawed attempt at imparting wisdom. Whose work did you show up to after getting in an argument on a message board? Call your anger management instructor and try to get your money back. Probably won’t be able to if it was court mandated.

Sorry to break it to you but I’ve never done any of the such. No anger management. I’m not angry. You’re the one talking about twisting people into pretzels and inviting them to pick a Wells Fargo to meet you at. I mean seriously? Yes I’m skilled with weaponry. It’s a hobby I’ve had for a long time. Good thing is I’ve never needed to use this skill set. Hopefully I never will. I pray not. But in this society today it surely cannot be ruled out. Perhaps you’ve seen gun sales hit record numbers time and again for many years. People get it and see what’s happening. And yes when I was younger a half a lifetime ago I might would have posted some ignorant comment on a message board such as the one you posted. That’s a long way from what you are insinuating. And I’ve never showed up to work and had a confirmation of any kind. Sorry to burst your bubble but I’ve never had anything but a speeding ticket. But yes I have a CWP in SC and a lot of guns. If that makes me the bad guy then I’ll gladly be the bad guy. And wisdom isn’t the message. Common sense would be more appropriate

 

[tigergrad03]

That guy has been posting weird stuff for a few days now.

Weird stuff? LOL! Ten years ago a “conspiracy theorist” was thought to be insane. I think given all that is happening that may have changed to some degree. But I’m not gonna try and convince you of anything. You’re seeing it already and unless God changes the course you’re likely to see much worse prior to November. Maybe inviting people to be twisted into a pretzel at a bank isn’t weird now days.

 

[Taylors_Tiger]

OP sorry for your loss. It seems like people think it’s some huge conspiracy and just bc the majority people dying are over 70 that it doesn’t matter bc if they get it will basically be “like the flu “ for them. I hate that attitude. Its selfish i understand older people are dying and may “be at end of their life” doesn’t mean they need to die bc of our stupidity and selfishness. I wonder if the same people saying only older people are dying are the same that say “all lives matter” when they hear about the blm movement.

 

[acwill07]

Weird stuff? LOL! Ten years ago a “conspiracy theorist” was thought to be insane. I think given all that is happening that may have changed to some degree. But I’m not gonna try and convince you of anything. You’re seeing it already and unless God changes the course you’re likely to see much worse prior to November. Maybe inviting people to be twisted into a pretzel at a bank isn’t weird now days.

Most of your posts seem to be long winded ways of telling us that you are the only enlightened one in the universe. Just an observation...

 

[CtLiEgMeSrOsN]

I told you where I’ll be. You can pick the nearest Wells Fargo if you want a home turf advantage. I’ll twist your ass into a pretzel. I’ll even bring the mustard.

So... you're gonna eat his ass with mustard?

 

[tigergrad03]

Most of your posts seem to be long winded ways of telling us that you are the only enlightened one in the universe. Just an observation...

Far from the only one. It’s hard to try and deliver a message of such magnitude with a short post. But I’m gonna sit back and listen like I have for the last 16 years for the most part.

 

[CUT93]

Edit: deleted by poster

Please wear a mask.

Prayers for your family! Sorry for your loss.