****Tillman Hall
- Thread starter Larry_Williams
- Start date
Not to mention SC used slavery as the basis when they announced they were leaving the union. Rewriting history is a great way to make one's heritage much nicer. Sort of like the Germans that don't believe in the holocaust.
Does this mean Nuk will start claiming Clemson in player intros now?
Asking for the concerned TI subscribers.
Asking for the concerned TI subscribers.
From the Clemson Website on Ben Tillman:
It is ironic that in 1923, only five years after Tillman’s death, Booker T. Washington’s colleague and fellow professor at Tuskegee Institute, George Washington Carver, was the first African-American guest lecturer at Clemson. Carver spoke to a full audience of nearly 1,000 cadets in the chapel in the Main Administration Building, later renamed Tillman Hall in 1946.
Doubtful. I think he's cited several reasons for not saying Clemson over the years, though some are probably internet bullshit that he never actually said.
What even is in the Main building anymore? Isn't part of it the College of Education?
My reaction, too. Those saying what great leadership was displayed by the BOT forget that just a few years ago, essentially the same board, rejected such a move.
Here's the rub. The South actually fought to preserve slavery, but the North did not fight to abolish it. They were fighting for different reasons.
Let's let Lincoln himself explain his motivation for going to war, as written in a letter to the New York Tribune in 1862 [source: Loewen]:
If I could save the Union without freeing any slave, I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves, I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone, I would also do that.
Last edited:
Haley Hall
Having one of your Alumni become the 1st Women elected Governor of SC is a pretty big deal...
Having one of your Alumni become the 1st Women elected Governor of SC is a pretty big deal...
Choosing to fight on the losing side has consequences. And unless a public university or government building is honoring them, nobody gives a crap.
Great move here. You can understand that Tillman and Calhoun and were integral in the history/establishment of Clemson without displaying their names across buildings. But given their disparaging backgrounds, they should not be celebrated and showcased.
You're not wrong, but SC used a lot of things. If it was all about slavery, SC could have simply hung around and accepted the Corwin Amendment. The actual history is a lot more complicated than people on the internet like to paint it to be. Fascinating topic worth reading about from books where you can check citations (most can be verified via Library of Congress). I dove into it a few years ago after the Charleston shooting when I saw so many completely different historical takes online. It turns out, both sides have a rewritten version of history. The truth is ugly.
It always strikes me as funny as the topic of symbols always came up. As a white guy who grew up in the south, I can say I wasn't ever taught to hate anybody except Yankees and Gamecocks (and those were from jokes). The Civil War was a war fought against...Yankees. All of the Civil War jokes I've heard in my life have been about...Yankees. In the Dukes of Hazzard they didn't like...Yankees. When me or anyone I knew saw confederate flags growing up we saw it as a southern symbol as opposed to...Yankees.
I grew up in Florence, SC and didn't have another white person make a racist joke to me until I was a sophomore in college in 1999...and that was quickly shot down.
https://www.battlefields.org/learn/articles/reasons-secession
Please resd the documents written as the southern states left the union. COUNT THE TIMES SLAVERY IS CITED.Very good move by the BOT. On the flip side, I understand the carvings of Confederate generals on the side of Stone Mountain in Atlanta will be removed by the end of the year. While I have no issue and even support removing the confederate flag from government facilities, I think the dismantling of historical monuments is tragic and more representative of terrorist groups like ISIS. So many seem to be hung up on any and all reference to the Confederacy as constituting slavery and racism when, in fact, the War Between the States was started over economic trade restrictions placed upon the Southern States by the Union. Slavery did not even factor into the equation until two years into the fighting when President Lincoln, a shrewd Republican politician, recognized that declaring the emancipation of slaves would cause potential chaos in the South, to the military advantage of the Union. Sadly, the war is almost exclusively attributed to slavery now, especially by those less knowledgeable living outside the South. I for one had ancestors who fought for the Confederacy, none of whom owned slaves. I suspect that the vast majority of Confederate soldiers owned no slaves and were fighting instead to protect their homes and freedoms. I will forever be ashamed and detest the idea of slavery or racism of any kind. I have great friends two beautiful God children that are black that I love dearly. However, I will always chose to honor my ancestors who risked there lives, were seriously wounded, captured and survived horrible northern prisons for the land they loved.
Please note that the confederacy prohibited any state joining the CSA from EVER outlawing slavery. So much for STATES RIGHTS.
You might want to reconsider what you wrote.
Bravo to the BOT.
Those are linked in the post directly above yours.
https://www.battlefields.org/learn/articles/reasons-secession
I respectfully disagree with all but a portion of that which you reference. I repeat, very few who were fighting owned slaves but were fighting for homeland and honor and commercial/international trading freedom of choice.
From the tone and gross analogy of your reply I respectfully ask that you kiss my grits!
I fully agree with your observation on who the fighting men were in the Civil War. I think the common man of the south was very poorly led by the rich, elite class of southern slave owners.
Thank you Ole Tom! I respect your opinions brother! And, Waylon is my favorite counter western singer!
They better start from Virginia and take all the statutes down thru the south to Texas. Skip florida
I salute anyone and everyone who might have listened to the entire speech of the Confederate VP without falling into an immediate and very deep sleep.
I think the only thing important in the speech is the very clear statement of the VP that the southern states seceded from the union to assure slavery was preserved forever.
I think the only thing important in the speech is the very clear statement of the VP that the southern states seceded from the union to assure slavery was preserved forever.
Don’t you mean they better start in the North and work there way down? How about we start with The Jefferson Memorial since Thomas owned slaves and what about our funding father, George Washington and his monument? Also, numerous Union soldiers, including Major Generals Grant, Sherman and Johnson owned slaves. Be careful trying to stereotype the South because this is a slippery slope here folks.
Last edited:
Actually most fought because their home states asked them to.
The US wasn't as unified back then. People thought of themselves as South Carolinians, Georgians, Virginians, etc.
Robert E Lee was actually offered command of the Army of the Potomac (not sure if it had been named that yet), but turned it down because he would not fight against Virginia.
Things like that are why you have to be careful when judging a historical figure by modern standards.
I can't find it but apparently there have been a couple of developments:
1) Some legislators are against this for whatever reason.
2) A midlands legislator has said Clemson should do it anyway, implying that Clemson doesn't have the guts to do it themselves. I suppose it's too much to ask for a lawmaker to know the damn law.
1) Some legislators are against this for whatever reason.
2) A midlands legislator has said Clemson should do it anyway, implying that Clemson doesn't have the guts to do it themselves. I suppose it's too much to ask for a lawmaker to know the damn law.
Similar threads
