OT: Malaysian Airline Shot Down?

[vatiger1]

Appears a 777 was just shot down (SAM) and 295 killed, of which, 23 were Americans. Flt from Amsterdam to Lumpur.

Interesting to see what the reaction and stance our POTUS takes with Putin and all the other whackos on the border of Ukraine.

 

[PAWrocka]

Originally posted by vatiger1:
Appears a 777 was just shot down (SAM) and 295 killed, of which, 23 were Americans. Flt from Amsterdam to Lumpur.

Interesting to see what the reaction and stance our POTUS takes with Putin and all the other whackos on the border of Ukraine.

well considering that our A-Hole and Chief came out yesterday and proclaimed more intense sanctions on Russia, and TODAY this happened?????? It would be wise for him to shut his whore mouth, because he cant/wont back it up.

2 more freakin years of this joker ......

 

[cwbarr1]

He will sign an Executive Order that bans firearms from being imported for Russia....... Oh wait he already did that yesterday. He will do nothing.....Putin makes Barry O rock in the corner sucking his thumb crying to Michelle "Mommy, make the bad man go away".
This post was edited on 7/17 2:30 PM by cwbarr1

 

[PAWrocka]

Originally posted by cwbarr1:
He will sign an Executive Order that banned firearms from being imported for Russia....... Oh wait he already did that yesterday. He will do nothing.....Putin makes Barry O rock in the corner sucking his thumb crying to Michelle "Mommy, make the bad man go away".

^this^

What woudl be worst is if he made purely politically motivated decisions in a effort to seem like a strong competent leader.

 

[vatiger1]

You my friend could not have summ'd up my feelings any better.

Guess a bigger question is why is a Civilian aircraft flying over an area that - well, is full of Surface to Air Missiles and armed forces with itchy trigger fingers?

Originally posted by cwbarr1:
He will sign an Executive Order that banned firearms from being imported for Russia....... Oh wait he already did that yesterday. He will do nothing.....Putin makes Barry O rock in the corner sucking his thumb crying to Michelle "Mommy, make the bad man go away".

 

[UNSWERVINGLY]

Those pricks shot down KLM flight 007 for getting to close to their airspace too.

VaTiger Billy Hong, who had just won the Greenville County Am a month earlier at Pebble Creek was on that flight. County Am starts tomorrow at Furman. I think about Billy every year since.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[cwbarr1]

Originally posted by CuWrX8314:

Originally posted by cwbarr1:
He will sign an Executive Order that banned firearms from being imported for Russia....... Oh wait he already did that yesterday. He will do nothing.....Putin makes Barry O rock in the corner sucking his thumb crying to Michelle "Mommy, make the bad man go away".

^this^

What woudl be worst is if he made purely politically motivated decisions in a effort to seem like a strong competent leader.

But for him to f**k up in that way would mean he has to cancel his Martha Vineyard's vacation. Not gonna happen, he will let Valerie Jarrett decide what the response should be based off polling data. Eric Holder will run around screaming that it was a racist plot that shot the plane down.

Ringling Brothers and Barnum and Bailey circus have nothing on the clowns in this administration.

 

[Transference]

I love these threads...

 

[NavyTigerSC]

Originally posted by nikao1002:
Those pricks shot down KLM flight 007 for getting to close to their airspace too.

VaTiger Billy Hong, who had just won the Greenville County Am a month earlier at Pebble Creek was on that flight. County Am starts tomorrow at Furman. I think about Billy every year since.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

It was Korean Air 007.

KAL007 actually did traverse Russian airspace.... but was outside and in international waters when it was ordered shot down.

 

[casellers84]

Originally posted by Transference:
I love these threads...

You can't drop something like this and leave us hanging, Tran. Please enlighten all the dumb, racist redneck from Powdersville ITT with your eternal wisdom.

 

[cwbarr1]

Originally posted by Transference:
I love these threads...

Picture of Trans when we start talking about his Emperor....

 

[blythewood tigers]

And what does vatiger1, CuWrX8314, cwbarr1 and nikao1002 suggest "we" do, if in fact, this jet was shot down?

Just curious since y'all seem very emotional about this.

 

[csvexm]

I guess Romney would have done better. ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[jimbob1019]

Can't say what the response should be off hand, but I do know there has got to be one...

This is basically Putin giving us the finger & saying "what are you gonna do about it?"

Unfortunately, Prez O probably won't do anything.

 

[Mr. Clemson]

Originally posted by csvexm:
I guess Romney would have done better. ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!

Your guess is correct.

 

[clemson1992]

At least he identified them as a threat.

 

[XTIGERK]

The inverse relationship between the amount of punctuation used and intelligence is fool proof.
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[TouchDown!Tigers!]

Originally posted by blythewood tigers:
And what does vatiger1, CuWrX8314, cwbarr1 and nikao1002 suggest "we" do, if in fact, this jet was shot down?

Just curious since y'all seem very emotional about this.

im thinking we should actually back ukraine. it appears russia needs to be reminded that eastern europe is no longer under soviet control. its bs they use the reasoning of protecting their citizens as grounds for taking territory from a sovern nation. tell your citizens to gtfo if youre actually concerned.

the west should have done something along time ago. without a complete russian withdrawl, we should offer our full military support. of course, id run this by the joint chiefs.

 

[cwbarr1]

Originally posted by blythewood tigers:
And what does vatiger1, CuWrX8314, cwbarr1 and nikao1002 suggest "we" do, if in fact, this jet was shot down?

Just curious since y'all seem very emotional about this.

Well sparkie, for starters, I am not really that emotional about it. It is what it is, and we continue to see that this administration is still over its head in global situations.

Now, we are pretty sure that the jet was shot down. When the head of the seperatist movement has confirmed they shot an aircraft down today that was flying in the same location as the crash site of flight MH-10, kinda points in the direction that somebody might've shot the thing down.

Next, instead of doing sanctions that really aren't doing much to hurt the Russians, we really should start targeting the Russian banks. Putting the squeeze on them will increase the pain. Putin knows this, why do you thing the is flying everywhere and trying to get BRIC's setup with China, Brazil, Iran etc.

We should also start targeting and freezing assets for Russian officials within the government and memebers of large companies. Again adding pressure on Putin. They currently hold about $165b in treasury bonds but seem to be in the process of dumping them on them on the market anyway. Since we have started the small sanctions they have dumped about $35b to this point anyway.

We should also suspend the $71.5m that we continue to give them every year in the name of foreign aid.

I would also start training exercises in Western Ukraine with a light Bde from the 173rd and the 2nd ACR. Create a rotation much like US forces do and have done in Kuwait.

So, in about 10 minutes that what I would do. How bout you Blythe? Keep drinking the progressive koolaid?

This post was edited on 7/17 4:10 PM by cwbarr1

 

[cwbarr1]

Originally posted by csvexm:
I guess Romney would have done better. ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[tifan!!!!]

Would have never gotten to this point if Romney had been

President !
This post was edited on 7/17 4:11 PM by tifan!!!!

 

[utgolfer]

There is nothing we can "do" about this. No way whatsoever a civilian airliner should be flying over a war zone. You've got amateur groups running around fighting each other and trying to shoot each others planes down, that's not an appropriate place for a 300+ passenger jet to be flying. This is a horrible, very sad tragedy and who in their right mind would fly on Malaysian Airlines right now. They've lost two 777's inside of a year.

We have absolutely no business meddling in this Ukraine mess. What does "back Ukraine" even mean? The corrupt former government that was fairly elected but overthrown? Or the current corrupt government that took over after the coup?

 

[firegiver]

Originally posted by cwbarr1:

Originally posted by blythewood tigers:
And what does vatiger1, CuWrX8314, cwbarr1 and nikao1002 suggest "we" do, if in fact, this jet was shot down?

Just curious since y'all seem very emotional about this.

Well sparkie, for starters, I am not really that emotional about it. It is what it is, and we continue to see that this administration is still over its head in global situations.

Now, we are pretty sure that the jet was shot down. When the head of the seperatist movement has confirmed they shot an aircraft down today that was flying in the same location as the crash site of flight MH-10, kinda points in the direction that somebody might've shot the thing down.

Next, instead of doing sanctions that really aren't doing much to hurt the Russians, we really should start targeting the Russian banks. Putting the squeeze on them will increase the pain. Putin knows this, why do you thing the is flying everywhere and trying to get BRIC's setup with China, Brazil, Iran etc.

We should also start targeting and freezing assets for Russian officials within the government and memebers of large companies. Again adding pressure on Putin. They currently hold about $165b in treasury bonds but seem to be in the process of dumping them on them on the market anyway. Since we have started the small sanctions they have dumped about $35b to this point anyway.

We should also suspend the $71.5m that we continue to give them every year in the name of foreign aid.

I would also start training exercises in Western Ukraine with a light Bde from the 173rd and the 2nd ACR. Create a rotation much like US forces do and have done in Kuwait.

So, in about 10 minutes that what I would do. How bout you Blythe? Keep drinking the progressive koolaid?

This post was edited on 7/17 4:10 PM by cwbarr1

I'm sure the old country wont mind the huge increase in energy bills either by having the Russian gas turned off. I agree we should be putting the squeeze on them IF its shown that the Russians did this. But it's not as simple as you make it sound.

 

[blythewood tigers]

Originally posted by cwbarr1:

Originally posted by blythewood tigers:
And what does vatiger1, CuWrX8314, cwbarr1 and nikao1002 suggest "we" do, if in fact, this jet was shot down?

Just curious since y'all seem very emotional about this.

Well sparkie, for starters, I am not really that emotional about it. It is what it is, and we continue to see that this administration is still over its head in global situations.

Now, we are pretty sure that the jet was shot down. When the head of the seperatist movement has confirmed they shot an aircraft down today that was flying in the same location as the crash site of flight MH-10, kinda points in the direction that somebody might've shot the thing down.

Next, instead of doing sanctions that really aren't doing much to hurt the Russians, we really should start targeting the Russian banks. Putting the squueze on them will increase the pain. Putin knows this, why do you thing the is flying everywhere and trying to get BRIC's setup with China, Brazil, Iran etc.

We should also start targeting and freezing assets for Russian officials within the government and memebers of large companies. Again adding pressure on Putin. They currently hold about $165b in treasury bonds but seem to be in the process of dumping them on them on the market anyway. Since we have started the small snactions they have dumped about $35b to this point anyway.

We should also suspend the $71.5m that we continue to give them every year in the name of foreign aid.

I would also start training exercises in Western Ukraine with a light Bde from the 173rd and the 2nd ACR. Create a rotation much like US forces do and have done in Kuwait.

So, in about 10 minutes that what I would do. How bout you Blythe? Keep drinking the progressive koolaid?




Sorry to disappoint but I'm as far from progressive as the current (2014) definition, it had a much different definition back in the 1800's but even that definition isn't how I would define myself.

Do you know how and why all of this got started in the first place?

 

[TouchDown!Tigers!]

this isnt even about the damn airliner. is the west just going to let russia have a free-for-all with whoever they want? georgia, ukraine, and the next nobody in your mind?

 

[cwbarr1]

Originally posted by firegiver:

Originally posted by cwbarr1:

Originally posted by blythewood tigers:
And what does vatiger1, CuWrX8314, cwbarr1 and nikao1002 suggest "we" do, if in fact, this jet was shot down?

Just curious since y'all seem very emotional about this.

Well sparkie, for starters, I am not really that emotional about it. It is what it is, and we continue to see that this administration is still over its head in global situations.

Now, we are pretty sure that the jet was shot down. When the head of the seperatist movement has confirmed they shot an aircraft down today that was flying in the same location as the crash site of flight MH-10, kinda points in the direction that somebody might've shot the thing down.

Next, instead of doing sanctions that really aren't doing much to hurt the Russians, we really should start targeting the Russian banks. Putting the squeeze on them will increase the pain. Putin knows this, why do you thing the is flying everywhere and trying to get BRIC's setup with China, Brazil, Iran etc.

We should also start targeting and freezing assets for Russian officials within the government and memebers of large companies. Again adding pressure on Putin. They currently hold about $165b in treasury bonds but seem to be in the process of dumping them on them on the market anyway. Since we have started the small sanctions they have dumped about $35b to this point anyway.

We should also suspend the $71.5m that we continue to give them every year in the name of foreign aid.

I would also start training exercises in Western Ukraine with a light Bde from the 173rd and the 2nd ACR. Create a rotation much like US forces do and have done in Kuwait.

So, in about 10 minutes that what I would do. How bout you Blythe? Keep drinking the progressive koolaid?


This post was edited on 7/17 4:10 PM by cwbarr1

I'm sure the old country wont mind the huge increase in energy bills either by having the Russian gas turned off. I agree we should be putting the squeeze on them IF its shown that the Russians did this. But it's not as simple as you make it sound.

Your right it isn't as easy as I made it sound, there are alot of variables. But the question was asked and I provided an answer, flash to bang of making all that happen, 6 months to a year.

Also, we have enough natural gas for the old country to easily make up for the loss from the Russians. Hell, the Russians are working to sell most of it to China anyway, or it is a stunt by Putin to threaten Europe for defying his whims.

 

[utgolfer]

Originally posted by cwbarr1:


Also, we have enough natural gas for the old country to easily make up for the loss from the Russians. Hell, the Russians are working to sell most of it to China anyway, or it is a stunt by Putin to threaten Europe for defying his whims.

This is absolutely false. The US is still a net natural gas importer, and we don't have the natural gas liquification terminals that are needed to export natural gas. The first one that has been approved for export of gas, Cheneire in Sabine Pass, LA, is still a few years away from operation. I think it is the only one that to date has been approved for an export permit. These things take years and billions to build.

This is from the EIA's annual report, linked below-only reason Im posting this is because there is the bizzare spin in the media that the US is somehow getting ready to export huge quantities of gas:

U.S. net imports of natural gas into the United States fell 14% in 2013,
continuing a decline that began in 2007. Robust natural gas production
in the United States likely displaced imports, which decreased by 8% in
2013 to 2,883 Bcf. Based on preliminary data for 2013, domestic dry natural gas production
increased by 1% to 24,282 billion cubic feet (Bcf), a new record.
Abundant production of natural gas helped reduce U.S. reliance on
foreign natural gas and helped maintain a high price differential
between domestic and foreign markets outside of North America,
increasing interest in the potential export of U.S. liquefied natural
gas (LNG).

US is a net natural gas importer, not exporter

 

[CUbeatFSU]

Originally posted by utgolfer:
There is nothing we can "do" about this. No way whatsoever a civilian airliner should be flying over a war zone. You've got amateur groups running around fighting each other and trying to shoot each others planes down, that's not an appropriate place for a 300+ passenger jet to be flying. This is a horrible, very sad tragedy and who in their right mind would fly on Malaysian Airlines right now. They've lost two 777's inside of a year.

We have absolutely no business meddling in this Ukraine mess. What does "back Ukraine" even mean? The corrupt former government that was fairly elected but overthrown? Or the current corrupt government that took over after the coup?

GTFO of here with this pragmatic, logical nonsense. You're interrupting a good Obama-bashing. Gotta kill the Commies!

 

[blythewood tigers]

Originally posted by CUbeatFSU:

Originally posted by utgolfer:
There is nothing we can "do" about this. No way whatsoever a civilian airliner should be flying over a war zone. You've got amateur groups running around fighting each other and trying to shoot each others planes down, that's not an appropriate place for a 300+ passenger jet to be flying. This is a horrible, very sad tragedy and who in their right mind would fly on Malaysian Airlines right now. They've lost two 777's inside of a year.

We have absolutely no business meddling in this Ukraine mess. What does "back Ukraine" even mean? The corrupt former government that was fairly elected but overthrown? Or the current corrupt government that took over after the coup?

GTFO of here with this pragmatic, logical nonsense. You're interrupting a good Obama-bashing. Gotta kill the Commies!

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^This^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

[rjohn19]

Yes- it could have been the "good guys" who did the shooting in this case. But funny how anything that goes wrong in the world is automatically Obama's fault. Maybe this should be blamed on Congress for not having passed background checks on missile purchases.

 

[cwbarr1]

Originally posted by blythewood tigers:

Originally posted by cwbarr1:

Originally posted by blythewood tigers:
And what does vatiger1, CuWrX8314, cwbarr1 and nikao1002 suggest "we" do, if in fact, this jet was shot down?

Just curious since y'all seem very emotional about this.

Well sparkie, for starters, I am not really that emotional about it. It is what it is, and we continue to see that this administration is still over its head in global situations.

Now, we are pretty sure that the jet was shot down. When the head of the seperatist movement has confirmed they shot an aircraft down today that was flying in the same location as the crash site of flight MH-10, kinda points in the direction that somebody might've shot the thing down.

Next, instead of doing sanctions that really aren't doing much to hurt the Russians, we really should start targeting the Russian banks. Putting the squueze on them will increase the pain. Putin knows this, why do you thing the is flying everywhere and trying to get BRIC's setup with China, Brazil, Iran etc.

We should also start targeting and freezing assets for Russian officials within the government and memebers of large companies. Again adding pressure on Putin. They currently hold about $165b in treasury bonds but seem to be in the process of dumping them on them on the market anyway. Since we have started the small snactions they have dumped about $35b to this point anyway.

We should also suspend the $71.5m that we continue to give them every year in the name of foreign aid.

I would also start training exercises in Western Ukraine with a light Bde from the 173rd and the 2nd ACR. Create a rotation much like US forces do and have done in Kuwait.

So, in about 10 minutes that what I would do. How bout you Blythe? Keep drinking the progressive koolaid?








Sorry to disappoint but I'm as far from progressive as the current (2014) definition, it had a much different definition back in the 1800's but even that definition isn't how I would define myself.

Do you know how and why all of this got started in the first place?

[/QUOTE]Why all of what got started???

If you refer to the conflict in Ukraine, you could almost say that it started with the ouster of President Kuchma. Then the follow-on protests and the start of the Orange Revolution. This pissing contest really goes back to 2004/05 and has the makings of a bad movie between Russia and Ukraine. But we did sign the Budapest Memorandum in 1994 that we must stand-by faithfully.




The Budapest memorandum provided that the three powers committed to respect the independence and sovereignty and the existing borders of Ukraine and to refrain from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of Ukraine. Significantly, the wording suggests Russia's insistence that Ukraine forgo an EU trade deal may have already breached the terms of the agreement. The signatories agreed to refrain from economic coercion designed to subordinate to their own interest the exercise by Ukraine of the rights inherent in its sovereignty and thus to secure advantages of any kind.

There is an arguement that this does not legally oblige the US and other western powers to intervene, I still say that it does require us to do something. Russia has already violated the spirit and letter of this agreement through the economic pressure applied to Ukraine in the run-up to the Vilnius Summit, when then president Viktor Yanukovich declined to sign the EU deal.

These are my thoughts, intrested to get your take Blythe.



This post was edited on 7/17 5:01 PM by cwbarr1

 

[JAMCRACKER99]

It almost seems as if some people would love to see the POTUS fail and make the wrong decision on this or anything else. It's the "cool thing" to do for some on the right to bash Obama for anything and everything. Makes good conversation I guess. The man could shit gold bricks and you guys would say they are spray painted. And unfortunately many in congress act the same way.

 

[Trading Tiger]

Originally posted by jimbob1019:
Can't say what the response should be off hand, but I do know there has got to be one...

This is basically Putin giving us the finger & saying "what are you gonna do about it?"

Unfortunately, Prez O probably won't do anything.

If you actually believe what you said there...

 

[utgolfer]

Originally posted by CUbeatFSU:

GTFO of here with this pragmatic, logical nonsense. You're interrupting a good Obama-bashing. Gotta kill the Commies!

And believe me, I think Obama is totally incompetent, but in all honesty, who among the current generation of politicians on both sides of the aisle are not.

I think some people also don't recall that the US Navy shot down an Iranian airliner in the Persian Gulf by accident back in 1988, with almost an identical loss of life. Should Russia or China have organized some sanctions against us for that? This is just a really, really sad situation with this plane being shot down, because it was so needless, there in nothing political about this event at all.

 

[cwbarr1]

Originally posted by utgolfer:

Originally posted by cwbarr1:


Also, we have enough natural gas for the old country to easily make up for the loss from the Russians. Hell, the Russians are working to sell most of it to China anyway, or it is a stunt by Putin to threaten Europe for defying his whims.

This is absolutely false. The US is still a net natural gas importer, and we don't have the natural gas liquification terminals that are needed to export natural gas. The first one that has been approved for export of gas, Cheneire in Sabine Pass, LA, is still a few years away from operation. I think it is the only one that to date has been approved for an export permit. These things take years and billions to build.

This is from the EIA's annual report, linked below-only reason Im posting this is because there is the bizzare spin in the media that the US is somehow getting ready to export huge quantities of gas:

U.S. net imports of natural gas into the United States fell 14% in 2013,
continuing a decline that began in 2007. Robust natural gas production
in the United States likely displaced imports, which decreased by 8% in
2013 to 2,883 Bcf. Based on preliminary data for 2013, domestic dry natural gas production
increased by 1% to 24,282 billion cubic feet (Bcf), a new record.
Abundant production of natural gas helped reduce U.S. reliance on
foreign natural gas and helped maintain a high price differential
between domestic and foreign markets outside of North America,
increasing interest in the potential export of U.S. liquefied natural
gas (LNG).

I see what your saying and your right, my apologies. So I am trying to figure out where the hell it is going if we are not consuming it nor exporting it, especially since we are outproducing Russia and Saudi Arabia. We outpaced Russia in 2012 by almost 11,700,000 metric cubic feet. Well, anyway another topic for another day.

EIA.Gov

 

[cwbarr1]

Originally posted by JAMCRACKER99:
It almost seems as if some people would love to see the POTUS fail and make the wrong decision on this or anything else. It's the "cool thing" to do for some on the right to bash Obama for anything and everything. Makes good conversation I guess. The man could shit gold bricks and you guys would say they are spray painted. And unfortunately many in congress act the same way.

Nope, hate to see any President fail. But it almost has become an art form for O. Becaue it is always someone elses fault other than his. I tired of listening to the same line now for the last six years. First two years, okay. But it has gone past lame now. There is plenty of blame to go around, but this admin and the senate just makes it to dang easy to pick apart.

This post was edited on 7/17 5:39 PM by cwbarr1

 

[csvexm]

Exactly. A lot of these issues the pres inherited from previous so called great presidents. How quickly we forget how some of the others performed while in office.

 

[utgolfer]

Originally posted by cwbarr1:
I see what your saying and your right, my apologies. So I am trying to figure out where the hell it is going if we are not consuming it nor exporting it, especially since we are outproducing Russia and Saudi Arabia. We outpaced Russia in 2012 by almost 11,700,000 metric cubic feet. Well, anyway another topic for another day.

We are consuming it is the thing. You can't easily store natural gas, so there has been a huge shift in US electricity production from coal to natgas. The reason its so much cheaper in the US than elsewhere is our gas has nowhere to go-no pipelines like in Europe. When you convert natgas to liquid (LNG), you lose 25% of it due to the energy needed for the conversion process. So some of the people that are trying to export it, they still figure that if its selling in Asia for $11-13/mmBTU, and they can buy it here for $4, even losing the 25%, can still make some money.

 

[Trading Tiger]

Originally posted by rjohn19:
Yes- it could have been the "good guys" who did the shooting in this case. But funny how anything that goes wrong in the world is automatically Obama's fault. Maybe this should be blamed on Congress for not having passed background checks on missile purchases.

Surprising as it is, I do agree with the more level headed posters ITT regarding the situation. One guy said, "this is basically Putin giving us the middle finger..." uuummmmmm, you crazy! How you mean innit? Putin saw a plane flying overhead, thought to himself "there must be some Americans on that plane, I'm going to shoot it down, FU America, ahahahaha!!!", and then gave the orders??? It gets thrown around a lot, but that statement, quite literally is the dumbest thing I have ever read on here.

But let's not get too crazy now, there are morons on both sides of the aisle. Another guy sarcastically asked if Romney would have done a better job. You bet your f**king @$$ he would have, anyone would have done a better job, ANY ONE. However, I will say this, and this is purely my opinion and I will admit that I am somewhat of a conspiracy theorist although a skeptical one; I actually think Obama has done a great job, everything he has done has gone according to plan. I just think that Obama, and more precisely, whoever truly has the power and is pulling his strings doesn't have America's best interest in mind. They've done a great job at being terrible.

But that could be completely crazy and I'm not going to spend any amount of time defending that position, it's just my simple opinion. However, I will say this will full conviction, anyone who tries to argue that Obama is anything other than a complete failure and the absolute worst president this country has ever had, well, they're just too dumb for me to even begin to debate with.

 

[blythewood tigers]

Originally posted by cwbarr1:





Originally posted by blythewood tigers:

Originally posted by cwbarr1:

Originally posted by blythewood tigers:
And what does vatiger1, CuWrX8314, cwbarr1 and nikao1002 suggest "we" do, if in fact, this jet was shot down?

Just curious since y'all seem very emotional about this.

Well sparkie, for starters, I am not really that emotional about it. It is what it is, and we continue to see that this administration is still over its head in global situations.

Now, we are pretty sure that the jet was shot down. When the head of the seperatist movement has confirmed they shot an aircraft down today that was flying in the same location as the crash site of flight MH-10, kinda points in the direction that somebody might've shot the thing down.

Next, instead of doing sanctions that really aren't doing much to hurt the Russians, we really should start targeting the Russian banks. Putting the squueze on them will increase the pain. Putin knows this, why do you thing the is flying everywhere and trying to get BRIC's setup with China, Brazil, Iran etc.

We should also start targeting and freezing assets for Russian officials within the government and memebers of large companies. Again adding pressure on Putin. They currently hold about $165b in treasury bonds but seem to be in the process of dumping them on them on the market anyway. Since we have started the small snactions they have dumped about $35b to this point anyway.

We should also suspend the $71.5m that we continue to give them every year in the name of foreign aid.

I would also start training exercises in Western Ukraine with a light Bde from the 173rd and the 2nd ACR. Create a rotation much like US forces do and have done in Kuwait.

So, in about 10 minutes that what I would do. How bout you Blythe? Keep drinking the progressive koolaid?








Sorry to disappoint but I'm as far from progressive as the current (2014) definition, it had a much different definition back in the 1800's but even that definition isn't how I would define myself.

Do you know how and why all of this got started in the first place?

Why all of what got started???

If you refer to the conflict in Ukraine, you could almost say that it started with the ouster of President Kuchma. Then the follow-on protests and the start of the Orange Revolution. This pissing contest really goes back to 2004/05 and has the makings of a bad movie between Russia and Ukraine. But we did sign the Budapest Memorandum in 1994 that we must stand-by faithfully.




The Budapest memorandum provided that the three powers committed to respect the independence and sovereignty and the existing borders of Ukraine and to refrain from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of Ukraine. Significantly, the wording suggests Russia's insistence that Ukraine forgo an EU trade deal may have already breached the terms of the agreement. The signatories agreed to refrain from economic coercion designed to subordinate to their own interest the exercise by Ukraine of the rights inherent in its sovereignty and thus to secure advantages of any kind.

There is an arguement that this does not legally oblige the US and other western powers to intervene, I still say that it does require us to do something. Russia has already violated the spirit and letter of this agreement through the economic pressure applied to Ukraine in the run-up to the Vilnius Summit, when then president Viktor Yanukovich declined to sign the EU deal.

These are my thoughts, intrested to get your take Blythe.




This post was edited on 7/17 5:01 PM by cwbarr1

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cwbarr1, everything you just stated is all for show. "Territorial integrity", "Sovereignty", "political independence", the list can go on and on. It boils down to one thing and one thing ONLY. Currency. Who's currency is on top via natural resources, assets, etc...

The screws are tightening on the dollar and there is NO way in hell this government is going to allow Ukraine to fall back under Soviet control. This country WILL go to war before that happens, mark it down. If it does fall back to the Russians, game over for the dollar sooner rather than later because the Russians will soon no longer accepting dollars from Europe for payment, i.e. ALL that gas flowing through Ukraine.

Some of the things you mentioned previously hits on my point somewhat, the billions in trade, NOT in dollars, between the BRIC's. A "copy" of the IMF (NO dollars) designed and operated by the BRIC's, future trade agreements made between European countries (are supposed allies) and the BRIC's, again, NOT in dollars. These have already begun and will continue with ever increasing frequency.

Do you have any comprehension on the amount of dollars coming back to the US if and when these "larger" events occur? Can you say INFLATION like this country has never seen the likes of!!! Your life, my life and everyone else on here is in for a VERY big surprise. You guys can talk all you want and pump your chest out and threaten the world but one thing IS for sure, the U.S.A. is completely, 100%, insolvent..... we are flat ASS broke!! The world knows this, it is no secret the mess we have gotten ourselves into.

I am not saying Russia or China or any other country is better off, all I am saying is the US had an UNBELIEVABLE approx. 70 yr. (WWII) advantage but one thing is ALWAYS true..... ALL fiat currencies come to an end and our (the dollar) time is almost up.