There’s plenty of healthy debate on here. It just gets drowned out by the overwhelmingly more frequent shitposting.
What Does the Republican Party Stand For in 2023?
- Thread starter okclem
- Start date
I would argue that the really left folks on this board reply more than post new threads. We all know who is the primary poster of new topics on here. He definitely is a MAGA guy.
It’s a trip to see all of you rabid libs have civil discourse. Makes me happy. So many thoughts and not enough brain power to organize them. Make party matter again. Right now you have career politicians on both sides of the aisle going in dry on the people every day. Let’s get term limits and age limits. Let’s get equal justice. Let’s get dick out of women’s bathrooms and sports. Let’s help our youth with student loans. Let’s stop ****ing over the rest of the world through NATO. Let’s fix immigration.
Same as the Democrat party: victory at nearly any cost.
That is unfortunately a serious answer....or atleast it's perhaps the most correct one. Both parties are essentially the same... They each vie for control of the levers of power by playing on fears of the masses and exploiting the plite of the people, both real and imagined.
Until the Republican Party can figure out how to unite the Republicans, the Republican Party is a joke. No in your face with the fvcking Libtards. No in your face with that fvcking old Libtard fool in the Whitehouse. Why? Chickenshits? The Democrats can't believe what they're railroading Trump for happens every single fvcking day in DC with those Libtard bastards.
So, IMO, since the Republicans no longer have any balls, they can proudly replace the GOP with The Eunuch Party of America.
So, IMO, since the Republicans no longer have any balls, they can proudly replace the GOP with The Eunuch Party of America.
I really hate these “both sides are the same” argument because there’s clearly a difference in the extremes that the actual elected officials are willing to go to.
From a general public or media stand point, I think you’re right - both sides are very similar. But the extremists on the right actually hold office and have power in government at all levels and the same is not true on the left.
Immigration needs to be fixed through congress. How many immigration bills has the republican controlled congress passed? How many have they voted on?
Every time a camera is on, they run in front of it and talk about immigration. But what have they done to fix it?
Joe Biden has done more to fix immigration since he became President than the GOP has.
FACTS.
You must be rich because thats got to be some good drugs you are on when you post this crap.
Here is what Biden did this year. Now name one bring that the gop congress has done. Holding press conferences doesn’t count.
FACT SHEET: Biden-Harris Administration Announces New Border Enforcement Actions | The White House
New Measures Leverage Success of Venezuela Enforcement Initiative to Limit Disorderly and Unsafe Migration While the courts have prevented the Title 42
Worst potus in modern history surpassing Carter. This is Bidens highlight.Here is what Biden did this year. Now name one bring that the gop congress has done. Holding press conferences doesn’t count.
FACT SHEET: Biden-Harris Administration Announces New Border Enforcement Actions | The White House
New Measures Leverage Success of Venezuela Enforcement Initiative to Limit Disorderly and Unsafe Migration While the courts have prevented the Title 42www.whitehouse.gov
Name one thing that the GOP congress has done. One. You can’t. Give up.
By the way, since Biden’s new Adriano took effect, border apprehensions have dropped significantly.
Thanks Joe.
I agree there is a difference in extremes the sides are willing to go to exploit their bases. But your statement has piqued my curiosity: just what is the "extreme" position on the right? Silly rhetoric from the publicy whores aside, just what, in your view, about the right is so "extreme"? Just what is "the right"?
I thought we were talking about Republicans and Democrats. While there are certainly ambiguities between our two major parties, nothing is more ambiguous than the label "right" and "left". I certainly don't see Republicans as being "on the right".
In my view, on the extreme left you have engineered societies with government control over all or most facets of life. On right, you have the opposite, which is anarchy....total self rule and survival of the fittest. Any other definition, again, in my view is a political definition...one constructed to suit your own worldview and to justify which party you root for.
Otherwise, I stand by my statement before. There is largely no difference between our two parties.
Their willingness to contest legal and verified election results. That wasn’t just rhetoric, there were actual senators who got on the floor and legally challenged the results, both before and after an attempted coup attempt - and they then refused to convict the primary instigator of said coup so h me couldn’t hold office again.
I’ve said it more than a thousand times.
The only good thing that has EVER come out of NY was an empty Greyhound bus.
If everything is so great in y’all’s liberal utopia, why do you come down south/here? Stay the heck up there. The only thing that place has going for it is it doesn’t get this hot.
I can hear y’all now….it’s hotter than a “Times Square Rolex”.
What's wrong with issuing a legal challenge against election results? This happens all the time at various levels. Although, against the backdrop of the myriad of outlandish conspiracy theories and the cult of personality that is Trump, I get the sentiment. Nevertheless, what batter way to restore a modicum of confidence in an election system by subjecting it to and seeing it upheld by intense legal challenge? I argue, considering all that has happened, not doing so might only make it more difficult to move on.
As for impeaching Trump over his deplorable behavior between the election and Jan 6, that was probably the strongest (and perhaps only legitimate) case against him. I can only assume that considering the man had to endure what was effectively a coup to have him removed from office over that absurd Russian collision hoax, maybe they just called it even?
So, repubs have the election hoax coup supporters and dems have their Russian hoax coup supporters.....that only supports my position that they're both the same. Let's just send them all packing!
What's wrong with issuing a legal challenge against election results? This happens all the time at various levels. Although, against the backdrop of the myriad of outlandish conspiracy theories and the cult of personality that is Trump, I get the sentiment. Nevertheless, what batter way to restore a modicum of confidence in an election system by subjecting it to and seeing it upheld by intense legal challenge? I argue, considering all that has happened, not doing so might only make it more difficult to move on.
As for impeaching Trump over his deplorable behavior between the election and Jan 6, that was probably the strongest (and perhaps only legitimate) case against him. I can only assume that considering the man had to endure what was effectively a coup to have him removed from office over that absurd Russian collision hoax, maybe they just called it even?
So, repubs have the election hoax coup supporters and dems have their Russian hoax coup supporters.....let's just send them all packing
I come back to SC to visit family, clients, and my newly purchased lake house. I have no intention to move there,
If you were able to read, you would notice that I was referencing norther magas that are moving down there and outbidding you for real estate. A train conductor here makes more than 90% of people in SC.
I hope you like Mets jerseys.
Again, terrible false equivalency. The investigation into Russian interference into the election A) provided actual evidence that they did, in fact, interfere and B) resulted in multiple people being convicted of crimes and sent to prison. Doesn’t really sound like a hoax.
On the other hand, you have a literal undermining of the democratic process to challenge election results that had been legally certified by the states and had gone through rigorous inspection by the courts.
So, again, one proved out to be based in fact that resulted in prison terms, the other resulted in an attempted coup. Which is more dangerous?
You guys are anchored around a couple of specific topics that you deem the measuring stick for extremism. The 2020 election chief among them. And I see your perspective, but it’s not as if there aren’t extreme people on the left that hold major elected office. Cori Bush is a pretty good example of a racial and left wing extremist. I don’t know that anyone on the right holds more extreme political views than someone like her.
The election debate has resulted in a pretty significant loss of perspective because it’s all-consuming for some.
How many people even know who Cori Bush is compared to a Lauren Boebert, Matt Gaetz, Marjorie Taylor Greene or other far right extremists? At least the extremists on the left are mostly ignored and don't have the bullhorn like the righties do.
Other right-wing extremism examples:
Very extreme on abortion rights
Fake culture war issues over CRT, drag queens and the LGBT community(Don't Say Gay and hundreds of other anti-LGBT bills)
Book banning
Black history banning
The rise of private, white nationalist paramilitaries
The rise of endless conspiracy theories spread by QAnon and thousands of internet keyboard warriors
Extreme rhetoric that has led to actual violence against those seen to be opposed to Trump (The Pelosi attacker, the Utah man killed last week, the guy who attacked the FBI office in Cincinnati, Cesar Sayoc the pipe bomber and the insurrection for just a few examples).
The election "debate" as you call it, deserves the scrutiny it has gotten because it tears at the fabric of our democracy.
Nothing and no one on the Left compares to what's happening on the other side, nothing.
12m Americans believe violence is justified to restore Trump to power
University of Chicago research finds support for violence to achieve political goals and general distrust of democracy
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We always knew Russia was/has/does attempt to sew chaos into our election system. Before the Russia collision naritve took hold, media was actually reporting about foreign entities negatively affecting both campaigns. The end goal being to sew division and undermine faith in our system. When Hilary inexplicably lost, the narrative shifted to focusing only in the aspects that supposedly benefit Trump.
As to the Trump, Russia collusion... Just who was convicted of colluding with Russia to swing the election Trump's favor? While there were certainly convections out of the Mueller investigation, none actually had anything to do with election interference. They were largely financial crimes (and/or lies about said crimes) committed working in other capacites and prior to working on the Trump campaign. Flynn's (which is or was being vacated or thrown out, if I'm not mistaken) was a gross miscarriage of justice and still not related to Russia Election collusion.
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Genuinely asking - which of her positions do you feel makes her “more extreme” than anyone on the right? A quick google search shows me she’s certainly to the left of most mainstream democrats, but I didn’t see anything that I would consider to make her fit to be called more extreme than others. Again, genuinely asking because there may well be stuff out there I didn’t see.
And you talk about the 2020 election issue being “all consuming” as if elections aren’t the very thing that makes the US a free country. As if free and fair elections and a peaceful transfer of power aren’t the most important elements of a free country.
And yeah, we can probably have a legitimate debate about voting laws and flaws within our elections, but by and large the US has become the greatest example of a functioning democracy in the history of the known universe on the back of our willingness to accept election results even when they don’t go the way we wish they would have.
And there’s a gigantic difference between saying “we believe a foreign government embarked on a misinformation campaign to sway voters in a certain direction” and saying “the election was rigged and fraudulent and invalid.” And it’s kind of crazy that people can’t understand that difference.
So yeah, 2020 election deniers or whatever we want to call them are, in my mind, the most extreme politicians in the country because what they’re doing is attempting to make a fundamental change to what makes America, America. And absolutely that is a non-starter for me when deciding where my vote goes. I will 100%, every time, choose someone with bad policy ideas over someone who acts as an existential threat to the foundation of our elections.
So you aren't voting for the 2016 election deniers on the left then either....and likewise you surely didn't vote for the 2000 election deniers?
Again, not pointing at wrongdings in attempt to excuse still more wrongdoing...just trying to drive home my point that our two parties are largely the same. They sew fear, then exploit the fearful...largely at all cost.
Some of her rhetoric that I’ve seen is totally off the rails. From a policy position, an example of extremism is reparations. Forcibly confiscating money from American taxpayers - who had absolutely nothing to do with slavery or even Jim Crow - to redistribute to African Americans who are 5+ generations removed from slavery is batshit insane.
The election stuff is bad, agreed. But it’s not really a policy position. It’s a singular event. I think some of them are just really stupid like some of the posters on here and have believed nonsense. I think some are charlatans attempting to profit - with votes, money, etc - on the ruse. I have no doubt politicians on the left would do the same should a similar ruse come about on their side.
Can you name the Democrats running for office in 2024 that brought or supported legal challenges in an attempt to throw out otherwise certified election results?
How many people even know who Cori Bush is compared to a Lauren Boebert, Matt Gaetz, Marjorie Taylor Greene or other far right extremists? At least the extremists on the left are mostly ignored and don't have the bullhorn like the righties do.
Other right-wing extremism examples:
Very extreme on abortion rights
Fake culture war issues over CRT, drag queens and the LGBT community(Don't Say Gay and hundreds of other anti-LGBT bills)
Book banning
Black history banning
The rise of private, white nationalist paramilitaries
The rise of endless conspiracy theories spread by QAnon and thousands of internet keyboard warriors
Extreme rhetoric that has led to actual violence against those seen to be opposed to Trump (The Pelosi attacker, the Utah man killed last week, the guy who attacked the FBI office in Cincinnati, Cesar Sayoc the pipe bomber and the insurrection for just a few examples).
The election "debate" as you call it, deserves the scrutiny it has gotten because it tears at the fabric of our democracy.
Nothing and no one on the Left compares to what's happening on the other side, nothing.
12m Americans believe violence is justified to restore Trump to power
University of Chicago research finds support for violence to achieve political goals and general distrust of democracywww.theguardian.com
Oh come on. You’ve done well in memorizing the democrat propaganda points.
Abortion is a matter of perspective. If you fundamentally believe that an unborn child is, in fact, a child, then it’s easy to understand a pro lifers position. Willfully destroying a human life is a big deal, after all. I hold a pro choice political position, but I’m not going to consider someone trying to protect an unborn child from a gruesome death extreme.
The “don’t say gay” bill was written to prevent the teaching of trans and homosexual stuff to kids until 3rd grade (or after 3rd grade?). As the parent of a child starting 2nd grade this month, that is hardly extreme.
Nobody is banning books or history. Books with age-inappropriate material were removed from school libraries. Some of the quotes I saw were certainly not suitable for children. We’re not talking Fahrenheit 451 here.
White nationalist paramilitaries… Ugh, ANTIFA? 2020 riots? Farrrrrr more mayhem and destruction caused by the left there.
Violence… Remember when that psychopath shot Steve Scalise? Remember when the lefty looney with a gun, knife and zip ties was arrested before attacking Judge Kavanaugh?
Yea, both sides.
Reparations are extreme and an obviously bad and untenable policy idea. However, it still falls well short of attempting to undo the very fabric of our democratic principles.
I’ve seen whataboutism before, but hypothetical whataboutism might be a new one.
Oh come on. You’ve done well in memorizing the republican propaganda points.
- The vast majority of Americans are pro-choice and when put to a referendum, even in red states, pro-choice wins in a landslide. The state legislatures that have gone to six weeks or less are all red and extreme when compared to the wishes of the people.
- The "Don't Say Gay" bill was completely unnecessary as you'll never convince me teachers up to third grade are talking about gay sex. But what it does is shame lgbt students of all ages and chills them into silence. 3rd grade you say? That was yesterday's news - it's now all grades.
So-called 'Don't Say Gay' rules expanded through 12th grade in Florida
The Florida Board of Education has voted to expand restrictions on classroom instruction related to sexual orientation and gender identity.
- Teachers are confused about what they can and can't say anymore because the laws are so vague. Teachers stopped teaching Shakespeare in some schools for fear of crossing DeSanctimonious. A principal in Florida was dismissed because a teacher showed the class a picture of Michelangelo's David for chrissakes. Moms for Liberty, ANOTHER right-wing extremist group, was behind the banning of Anne Frank and a MAGA parent was even able to get the poem read by Amanda Gorman at the inauguration pulled from the shelf because it contains "hate messages" holy shit...
- Antifa is a tired response to right-wing paramilitary groups because for one, they don't even identify as democrats, they aren't coddled by Dem legislators or run for office like the groups on the Right do and they would never be defended for a prison sentence that resulted from their rioting. NOT the same.
- We have many more examples of violence and violent rhetoric spawned from the cult of Trumpism than random lefties that have attempted attacks. The ones on the Right are directly connected to an ex-President, who doesn't denounce them and even mocks the victims (Pelosi). NOT the same.
We might have a few kooks here and there but Trump has spawned an entire industry of them.
You just can't make them the same, because they're not and you know it in your gut.
🤔 None that I know of....yet.
Anyway, I wasn't trying to go tit for tat with you on this point. I firmly believe the so-called threat to our democracy during the ridiculous charade on Jan 6 is grossly overstated. No freaking way anyone was close to overthrowing anything. To state otherwise is just flat out preposterous. No way anyone at any level of government nor would the overwhelming majority of the American people have stood for that for one second. I mean, what seriously could have happened? So you don't certify the vote...so someone interrupts the proceeding...then you do it a few hours or perhaps even a day later. The inauguration would have gone on as scheduled. End of story. It was nothing more than a ridiculous, shameful display encouraged by ridiculous and shameful president. If anything, Jan 6 only reaffirms the resiliency of our Republic.... Or as you like to say, our (gag), "democracy"(*).
(*)If that last statement gives you pause, consider this quote from Jean-Jacques Rousseau in the Social Contract, circa 1762:
I contend that the underlined passage above is the very essence of what it means to be a conservative...which is what I consider myself to be... well, largely a libertarian-conservative. As such, I have no party.
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Good post. 1/6 had been made into far more than what it was. Didn’t a similar number of people (maybe more?) attempt to secede from the country when they created CHAZ in Seattle a few years ago? Of course that hard left concept quickly died when it devolved into chaos and people well, died. It’s easy to find pockets of lunacy. 1/6 was a very public display of that and one that has been amplified far beyond its gravity.
Holy false equivalency, Batman. I respect some of the stuff you write on here, but what an absolute whitewashing of January 6th. It was an attempt to interfere with the official proceedings related to the peaceful transfer of power from one administration to the next. Something that we have always been proud of as Americans.
The vile "patriots" of 1/6/21 were not attempting to take over the government or secede. They were attempting to create enough chaos and disruption to buy more time for a losing administration that had none left. Just because they didn't succeed in-full doesn't make it any less appalling or worthy of condemnation/punishment.
Were those hippies at the Chaz trying to overturn the will of the people? Were they doing it on behalf of a political figure? Let me know when you see politicians and/or rank and file Dems defending their actions and advocate pardoning them.
I get it, you want to make the Republican party look more electable and less threatening in fear that your taxes might go up, but this is not the hill you want to die on.
Vile, appalling... Yes... a threat to our Republic... No.
I'll be happy to retract that statement if someone can lay out for me just how this would have led to an effective coup and Trump continuing to hold office. Otherwise, all you are doing is allowing your party to further exploit and manipulate you. The Dem party hired a marketing firm for goodness sakes in an attempt to continue to promote a specific narrative and capitalize on Jan 6. Who does that? (Hint: someone who doesn't have our country's best interest at heart)
Oh come on. You’ve done well in memorizing the republican propaganda points.
- The vast majority of Americans are pro-choice and when put to a referendum, even in red states, pro-choice wins in a landslide. The state legislatures that have gone to six weeks or less are all red and extreme when compared to the wishes of the people.
- The "Don't Say Gay" bill was completely unnecessary as you'll never convince me teachers up to third grade are talking about gay sex. But what it does is shame lgbt students of all ages and chills them into silence. 3rd grade you say? That was yesterday's news - it's now all grades.
So-called 'Don't Say Gay' rules expanded through 12th grade in Florida
The Florida Board of Education has voted to expand restrictions on classroom instruction related to sexual orientation and gender identity.abc7ny.com
- Teachers are confused about what they can and can't say anymore because the laws are so vague. Teachers stopped teaching Shakespeare in some schools for fear of crossing DeSanctimonious. A principal in Florida was dismissed because a teacher showed the class a picture of Michelangelo's David for chrissakes. Moms for Liberty, ANOTHER right-wing extremist group, was behind the banning of Anne Frank and a MAGA parent was even able to get the poem read by Amanda Gorman at the inauguration pulled from the shelf because it contains "hate messages" holy shit...
- Antifa is a tired response to right-wing paramilitary groups because for one, they don't even identify as democrats, they aren't coddled by Dem legislators or run for office like the groups on the Right do and they would never be defended for a prison sentence that resulted from their rioting. NOT the same.
- We have many more examples of violence and violent rhetoric spawned from the cult of Trumpism than random lefties that have attempted attacks. The ones on the Right are directly connected to an ex-President, who doesn't denounce them and even mocks the victims (Pelosi). NOT the same.
We might have a few kooks here and there but Trump has spawned an entire industry of them.
You just can't make them the same, because they're not and you know it in your gut.
Just a couple of points while I have a couple min.
You continue to reference public sentiment about abortion and consider something opposed to that as “extreme.” Again, I’m siding with the public here politically, but I also understand a pro life stance if you believe in your heart that a child become a human life at conception. I saw my kids’ beating hearts at 8 weeks old. That was my child, a living human being. 8 weeks.
I’m not going to consider someone “extreme” for wanting to prevent the indiscriminate killing of that life. That’s a matter of perspective, not extremism.
On the violence, you replied to ANTIFA but not the 2020 riots. You said these people wouldn’t be coddled and defended by dem legislators. Umm, the sitting vice president literally raised bail money for rioters and looters and other criminals in 2020. These people were defended and their actions deflected by swathes of democrats. And this wasn’t some group of 50 dudes playing combat dress up and jerking each other off. This was hundreds of thousands of criminals causing BILLIONS of dollars of damage.
When have you seen “white nationalists” cause that kind of mayhem?
I’m not a fan of trump, what the MAGA movement has become or culture wars. It’s sullied the Republican party for sure. But to pretend that the crazy is wholly one-sided is just inaccurate.
I don't have time to explain current events to you, but it's been well-documented that there was a plan to delay the proceedings as much as possible in an effort to send competing elector slates back to the state legislatures (the majority of which are controlled by Republicans) to determine which ones to accept. That would have set off an unprecedented constitutional crisis in an attempt to disregard the will of the voters.
Again, just because it didn't work doesn't mean it was any less of a threat.
