Don’t try to “read” someone who has pathologically lied to friends, family, co-workers, and destitute clients for years and years and years — someone who has lied about the most serious of matters.
Just look at the facts of the case instead.
⚖️ MURDAUGH MURDERS & TRIAL THREAD ⚖️
- Thread starter OldMTPTiger
- Start date
Just look at the facts of the case instead.
Been telling my wife something similar. Since the beginning I’ve felt like he’s protecting Buster.
The only way his legacy carry’s on.
That's their job. It's just like Larry Williams reporting on Clemson football. Do you disrespect him?
Calling someone who believes they have found doubt a narcissist because they choose to hold out is ridiculous. Sure the jury decides as a whole but it’s your vote to give. you should stand up for what you individually believe to be true. Not what someone else wants you to do. God, I hope you are never on a jury.
True time of death, if his weapons were the real weapons used, and him actually not being pinged with Maggie’s phone are some of the things I have doubt in.
I am one of the most prolific cell phone users you will find. I spend roughly 8-10 hours a day on my phone. It’s not uncommon for me to be in the middle of talking to someone and stop for an hour or two. I don’t 100% buy that the cellphones ceasing is the time of death. Sorry, people are not even paying attention to any of the defense witnesses because those people decided before the trial he was guilty.
I still have a serious problem with the angle of that one shot. Bullets don’t arc they travel in straight lines. The upward trajectory had to come from somewhere. I’m not saying the shooter was 5’ 2” but I find it hard to believe at 6’4 he made that shot.
I also see that everyone wants to point out that Alex lied but sled wanted “their man” so bad they also lied on the stand and to the grand jury for the indictment in the first place. That is one of the biggest disgraces to this entire trial. One that has been drastically over looked. However, I can assure you it will be mentioned more than a handful of times in that 2+ hour closing.
Last edited:
The jury doesn’t see that and who cares. That is a statistic and they can be manipulated. That proves absolutely nothing.
Say what?
I’d just like to think that if I were a defense attorney, I would turn down a case if I was pretty sure my client murdered his son or an obvious child rape case, etc. I’m pretty sure you could refer that person elsewhere.
I know everyone “deserves a fair trial”. I get it. You don’t want an innocent guy going to jail. I’m just saying it’s tough for me to respect the person who is defending a child rapist or whatever.
What I’ve been told by a buddy of mine who is an attorney is that if you at least provide a somewhat adequate defense for a guy that you’re certain raped a kid, then he is going to get prosecuted anyway, and that by providing a good defense means that he will likely lose the appeal.
Last edited:
Shooting from the golf cart would make him about 5’2.
Bullets do arc. Ask any sniper.
That’s my assumption
Edit - reports that it is for contraband, sister giving him a book. If so, you have to think she gets charged too (in any normal situation anyways)
Last edited:
The shell casings were found inside the feed room, so he had to have been off of the golf cart at that point. I can see your point though. I just think he had help, or set it up for someone else who was either already there or waiting.
Huh. He lied for 2 years and then once he heard state’s case he changed his story to match it. So now you believe him?
The problem is he is framing his lying because of his pill addiction. Addiction is so widespread that at least one juror has a family/friend that has dealt with addiction. I think that alone is going to cause sympathy from at least one juror. I do not think he is innocent BUT there is no hard evidence saying he was involved.
what do you want highlighted in the closing for the state?
I will work on a closing argument and post it before they do their closings
I will work on a closing argument and post it before they do their closings
I for the life of me don’t see how you find that “the most logical”. There isn’t one fact that gives rise to any reasonable doubt that AM killed them both himself. There was time, motive, opportunity and the defendant has repeatedly lied about numerous aspects of the case and now has admitted as such.
The truth is you simply can’t imagine him doing it because he seems believable to you. He sees caring and how could he do that to the boy he supposedly loved.
Why does he seem believable when his own mouth has stated that he lied daily for years stealing money and breaking the law In other ways as well.
The only way this many facts can reasonably be dismissed is if there were real concern or evidence to suggest he was being framed. He wasn’t, there isn’t anyone else involved.
He wasn’t on his phone the entire time. There is a time line posted on here with the exact call times and texts. The phone logs fit with in the state‘s case.
At first the short time period 8:49-9:02 gives pause. You think how could he do all that and still make the leaving time? But look at it differently. He had all the time in the world after he killed them. But it obviously helps his alibi if he can get off of the property ASAP. It’s to his benefit to rush so fast. The video with his voice in the background is stuff of Columbo.
[/QUOTE]
They are doing their job. They took an oath to hold up.
They are doing their job. They took an oath to hold up.
True bad choice of words. But it also takes long distances. Which we did not have. I also use a crappy word. I was just trying to say they travel in a straight path which they do. They don’t randomly change direction without interferences.
Alex‘s entire life was a lie. I think you have just decided to be the contrarian, I doubt you truly believe much of what you espouse, it‘s easy to play devils advocate when it really doesn’t matter.
I don’t know what will happen with this jury. I know what should happen. The man is 100% guilty.
The entire family believes they can do what they want, the rules don’t apply to them.
Totally agree...... But I still think they need more hard evidence. Murdaugh is a scumbag scam artists. He is a thief and preyed on clients. But none of those factors mean he is guilty of murder. Do I think he is involved? I certainly do BUT he sits an innocent man as of now and I just have not seen enough evidence to convince me otherwise.
I’m not being a contrarian at all. I have seen the evidence. I think it comes short of proving beyond reasonable doubt that he pulled the trigger. That’s just my opinion. I’m not the only one I’m here saying it. Just simply read back and see that several share my opinion. Just because I choose to not see it like you doesn’t make me wrong. I’m giving an honest opinion that if I was on the jury, the end result would be not guilty or hung. I could not give Alex a guilty verdict saying that he pulled the trigger. I don’t think the evidence is there for that fact. Everyone in here that says, “how could anyone think he is innocent” ignored every bit of the defense. They are also forgetting that the prosecution lied to the grand jury to even get the indictment.
If by some chance he is found guilty, it won’t be over. He most definitely will get an appeal with everything that had gone on.
True but they will frequently look to him for guidance. Guarantee you someone will take control in that jury room. If first vote is 9-3 or 10-2 guilty then there is a chance. If not will be a hung jury.
Questions are......Will there be a second trial if the jury's hung ?
Is there a time limit on that ?
He is gonna use this drug addiction to try to lower the sentence on the financial crimes as well , if he gets off here.
IMHO the right thing to do would be to wait and see what happens with the financial crimes. Then see his sentencing for that. If he is going to basically die in prison anyway, imho the state would be doing the SC tax payers an injustice by spending the millions it will cost to go trough an additional trial.
Statistics also show that the state would be fighting an even larger up hill battle as the second trial tends to favor the defense at that point. The evidence won’t change so most likely you get a hung jury then which means it’s officially over without a new charge like accessory.
Likely more than he has left, unless something crazy happens. Not to mention he has already admitted to a bunch of them on the stand. That’s one reason why waters harped on them so long. He played it safe while risking losing the jurors attention for the murder during his cross. That testimony will be used a lot in those cases.
Haha..WOW....that is humorous....so he lied his whole life and stole from his clients, he lied to the police and his family until the video appeared but SUDDENLY on the stand he is telling the truth. He is a narcissist and had a month of trial sitting in jail and listening to the evidence to come up with this.
Every body language expert I've seen on tv thinks he lying. All that lip smacking and tongue activity is a dead giveaway, isn't it?
And buster rubbing his eye during his testimony....I can't recall the question but his averted eyes, looking down while rubbing his eye...had to be a lie.
I see this often: state will spend millions etc etc
Aren’t all those State employees? Prosecutors, investigators, LE? Aren’t they getting paid regardless of if they are working on this case, or another case? Surely the outside expert testimony doesn’t cost millions?
Seems inappropriate that the defense would pander to the jury by telling them he’ll spend a long time in prison on the financial crimes alone. Though he’s admitted to them, he hasn’t been tried much less sentenced. The jury should not be influenced by his potential punishment there, but the defense has given them “a way out” so rendering a guilty murder verdict isn’t on their conscience.
no time limit on decision to try a second time
I would expect the state would wait to see how much time he gets on Theft crimes
Lots of years on paper but as many have alluded to here, white collar (financial) crimes are easier to reduce and/or challenge
He still thinks he can get out at some point if no murder conviction
The nightly show on Court TV (I think) hosted by Vinnie....it's a tough watch but they had 6 white women as their jury last night and all 6 think he's guilty and all 6 think he's lying and not likeable. Most or all of the 6 think waters is likeable.
Thanks......If he lives to 75 he probably will get out. People like to say life for the financial stuff but that will never happen but 20-30 years is possible. He has finally admitted he did all of them so a plea situation is most likely unless he decides to go to court and use his drug addiction to get sympathy and hope for a lower sentence
I think the closing has to tug at the hearts to “do the right thing” and help the jurors get there. The closing argument is really only for about 2-3 of them anyways. What are those 2 or 3 people struggling with? I think they are struggling with believing AM could kill Paul the way he did and maybe Maggie but Paul for sure.
I think you hit on the facts but you have to hit on the depth of ”sick” that Alex really is and I think you have to highlight the wrong things he has done to people he “cared” for. People he claims he still cares for today. He is capable of doing really bad things to people he cares for when something else bigger is at stake.
He cared more about his reputation, his family name, and not being discovered. He cared more about avoiding disgrace and jail time than he did his own flesh and blood. Paul and Maggie were a sacrifice he was willing to make to save his own hide. It probably wasn’t as hard for AM to make that decision given that Paul‘s stupid actions were what put him in this position to begin with. If not for the boat accident, none of this comes to light.
I don’t doubt that Alex loved Paul and Maggie at some level, but Alex loved himself more. He is the type of person that did everything with the goal of helping himself, making himself feel better, look better and it didn’t matter who had to suffer for it.
Alex wouldn’t have blinked an eye to kill me or you. It probably gave him pause to do what he did to Paul and Maggie, but as the evidence shows, he did it anyways. He decided that the only way he could avoid destroying 4 generations of legacy and his own life was to kill Paul and Maggie in such a way that it would distract from the ever so tightening noose around his own neck.
Every one is entitled to a defense and it is the job of the defense team to propose different theories And point the finger at others. The only theory the defense can come up with in this case is a nameless 5’2” social media vigilante. The facts are so convincing and shine the light so bright on Alex Murdaugh, the best they can come up with is a 5’2” social media vigilante. Who by the way was clairvoyant enough to know he didn’t need to bring his own weapon to perpetrate the crime.
No, we don’t have a video of Alex shooting Paul and Maggie. No, we don’t have an eye witness, but what we do have is a lot of hard facts about where Alex was and when. What he did before and after Paul and Maggie were killed and they all point the finger in one direction... Alex Murdaugh. There is no mistaking that Alex Murdaugh was one of 3 people at the kennels on the 7th of June at 8:45 pm. After 2 plus years of repeatedly lying to law enforcement, friends and family, Alex finally admitted what we have known all along. He was at the kennels that night. We also know that of the 3 people who were alive at 8:45 two died shortly later and he is the last one to see them alive.
Alex would have you believe he “got out of there” and went back to the house and didn’t hear all the gun shots. That he wouldn’t have simply driven by the kennels to tell Paul and Maggie he was leaving. The only reason Maggie came to Moselle was to go with Alex, but somehow she didn’t go.
Alex has lied repeatedly in this case, over and over changing his story to try and fit it to the facts so he looks less guilty. I would tell the jury don’t let him get away with that. Alex Murdaugh has admitted in this very court room to living the life of a criminal for the last 15 years, stealing from the destitute, corruption, drugs and who knows what we haven’t discovered yet. This is just one more crime in a long series of crimes committed daily.
Alex was a desperate man and he was willing to try a desperate act to get the focus off of himself. He killed Paul and Maggie and they deserve justice, they deserve to have the father and husband they trusted, and who gunned them down in cold blood, go to jail for his crimes.
Don’t let the duty entrusted to this Jurry fall to others in the financial cases. You are required to serve justice for these crimes, not them. Paul and Maggie deserve Justice, the people of Hampton deserve justice, the people of Colleton County deserve justIce, this very State deserves justice. Don’t let Alex Murdaugh off scot free because of his last name, because he happens to be skilled in the art of BS. Don’t let him fool this jury like he has fooled so many for years, return a guilty verdict.
Last edited:
