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LoL Trump Indicted by Feds. LOCK HIM UP 🔐

okclem said:
Hey, don't worry too much about this one. Save your real angst for the Jan 6 indictments, which will sweep up dozens of more Republicans who plotted to overthrow the U.S. government.
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And you really believe this which is sad.
 
Smith is a known slimeball and Weismann is still chasing the white whale too in the background.

 
TigerRagRob said:
The moment POTUS talks about something or shows something its declassified on the spot. POTUS doesnt have any process to get approval since POTUS is the ultimate authority on the matter. This is the power every POTUS has and are the only ones with that power...

aw-
Records management requirements The Presidential Records Act gives records management authority for incumbent Presidential records to the President, and states that personal records should be kept separate upon their creation or receipt from the Presidential record files [44 U.S.C. § 2203(b)]. The Office of the White House Counsel generally provides PRA policy guidance. Although NARA has limited records management authority over incumbent Presidential records, NARA routinely provides records management guidance based on its institutional knowledge and expertise to the incumbent Administration upon request. White House staff responsible for maintaining file systems must be trained to keep personal records separate from Presidential records at the point of creation. Once items have been mixed, it becomes difficult to determine record status. Since the President has the discretion to determine what is personal material, this determination should be made during the incumbent’s term of office rather than after the records are transferred to NARA.

The Court ruling-
In the Court's view, plaintiff reads too much into this statement. Under the statutory scheme established by the PRA, the decision to segregate personal materials from Presidential records is made by the President, during the President's term and in his sole discretion, see44 U.S.C. § 2203(b), so the Deputy Archivist could not and did not make a classification decision that can be challenged here. When she posited that perhaps the plaintiff was asking NARA “to make a further determination that the materials in question ought to be considered ‘[P]residential records,’ ” she was, if anything, as counsel for the defendant suggested at the hearing, opining on the question of whether there were grounds for the Archivist to choose to invoke the enforcement mechanism embodied in the statute. Tr. at 8; 23–24. But, neither plaintiff nor defendant believes that is a decision that is at issue in this lawsuit, see id., at 8–9, 37, 42, and 50, and, as is discussed below, such a decision would not be reviewable in any event.
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This entire bolded paragraph is completely wrong.
 
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Dungeon09 said:
I’ve had a top secret and worked with similar information to some of the defense stuff called out in the indictment in the past.

If I did like 1/10 of this I’d get a decade plus in fed.
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Me too and we talked daily about Hillary and her minions getting away with murder on no prosecution yet the average grunt would serve jail time which some did

There was a level you got to that taking documents out didn ‘t matter

The lower level today still suffer harsh treatment

Joe Biden if we judge by the same standard as Trump is toast

On the pay for play Joe Biden may even hit tge treason button and death penalty depending on the amounts of bribes he accepted which I am hearing from my contacts in the intelligence community may exceed 50 million laundered through all kinds of channels to hide the money

Let’s show it all and let all pay the consequences
 
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Dungeon09 said:
I’ve had a top secret and worked with similar information to some of the defense stuff called out in the indictment in the past.

If I did like 1/10 of this I’d get a decade plus in fed.
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I would agree with this completely. I also agree that there's a two tier justice system. Just not Trump... then everyone else. The political/famous/rich class (throw a bit of race in there if you want to) get one tier of justice... everyone else gets the other.

If you and I had top secret documents, you wouldn't get a year and a half to dither about giving them back. Dudes would be kicking in our door and hauling us off to jail while that got sorted out. Kind of the same with Biden/Pence. If we self reported, we'd still probably get arrested at some point although it would be a lot friendlier.
 
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other1 said:
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Typical Trump here. Remember when he made fun of Obama for playing golf? Then told us that he wouldn't be playing golf... he'd be in the Oval Office working. That's before he put the golf simulator in the White House of course and spent more time than Obama playing.

Trump is definitely the kind of guy with the highest standards (for other people). More of a do as I say, not as I do kind of guy. One of the many reasons that I'm BAFFLED by the love he gets from conservatives, b/c as a rule they HATE shit like that... it's one of the reasons they hate liberal "elites".
 
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hopefultiger13 said:
Typical Trump here. Remember when he made fun of Obama for playing golf? Then told us that he wouldn't be playing golf... he'd be in the Oval Office working. That's before he put the golf simulator in the White House of course and spent more time than Obama playing.

Trump is definitely the kind of guy with the highest standards (for other people). More of a do as I say, not as I do kind of guy. One of the many reasons that I'm BAFFLED by the love he gets from conservatives, b/c as a rule they HATE shit like that... it's one of the reasons they hate liberal "elites".
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They have no clue what they hate anymore. They just hate.
 
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firegiver said:
They have no clue what they hate anymore. They just hate.
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No, they do. They hate anyone that crosses Trump. The Republican party used to stand for things that mattered. Not any more. The folks on here would CHEERFULLY set aside the constitution to get Trump in power... Just as Trump said should be done.
 
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PalmettoTiger1 said:
On the pay for play Joe Biden may even hit tge treason button and death penalty depending on the amounts of bribes he accepted which I am hearing from my contacts in the intelligence community may exceed 50 million laundered through all kinds of channels to hide the money
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That’s funny because I’m actually hearing from my people that it’s a nothingburger.
 
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WapPride said:
This entire bolded paragraph is completely wrong.
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Meh, it sort of is though. Lots of folks are forgetting that the Courts have already ruled on this once.......and it went in favor of Bill Clinton, former president for similar infractions. There is already precedence.

The only time NARA is involved is if there is disposal of documents, don't think he was disposing of any documents.

“Amy Berman Jackson, the judge presiding on that case, said a couple of very important things,” said Farrell. “That the president had an absolute, unreviewable right to take any records or documents that he wants when he leaves office. “

“No one can come back and second guess or double think or ask questions about what the president elects to take with him,” Farrell continued.

In her ruling, Jackson wrote that “the President enjoys unconstrained authority to make decisions regarding the disposal of documents: ‘[a]lthough the President must notify the Archivist before disposing of records . . . neither the Archivist nor Congress has the authority to veto the President’s disposal decision.’”

Farrell points out that this ruling has existed without challenge or question for ten years.
 
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jakefest said:
Meh, it sort of is though. Lots of folks are forgetting that the Courts have already ruled on this once.......and it went in favor of Bill Clinton, former president for similar infractions. There is already precedence.

The only time NARA is involved is if there is disposal of documents, don't think he was disposing of any documents.

“Amy Berman Jackson, the judge presiding on that case, said a couple of very important things,” said Farrell. “That the president had an absolute, unreviewable right to take any records or documents that he wants when he leaves office. “

“No one can come back and second guess or double think or ask questions about what the president elects to take with him,” Farrell continued.

In her ruling, Jackson wrote that “the President enjoys unconstrained authority to make decisions regarding the disposal of documents: ‘[a]lthough the President must notify the Archivist before disposing of records . . . neither the Archivist nor Congress has the authority to veto the President’s disposal decision.’”

Farrell points out that this ruling has existed without challenge or question for ten years.
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The American Bar Association would disagree:

In all cases, however, a formal procedure is required so governmental agencies know with certainty what has been declassified and decisions memorialized. A federal appeals court in a 2020 Freedom of Information Act case, New York Times v. CIA, underscored that point: “Declassification cannot occur unless designated officials follow specified procedures,” the court said.
Some secrets, such as information related to nuclear weapons, are handled separately under a specific statutory scheme that Congress has adopted under the Atomic Energy Act. Those secrets cannot be automatically declassified by the president alone and require, by law, extensive consultation with executive branch agencies.

Edit: I do want to add, however, that the extent of a president’s legal authority to unilaterally declassify materials — without following formal procedures — has yet to be challenged in court.
 
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WapPride said:
The American Bar Association would disagree:

In all cases, however, a formal procedure is required so governmental agencies know with certainty what has been declassified and decisions memorialized. A federal appeals court in a 2020 Freedom of Information Act case, New York Times v. CIA, underscored that point: “Declassification cannot occur unless designated officials follow specified procedures,” the court said.
Some secrets, such as information related to nuclear weapons, are handled separately under a specific statutory scheme that Congress has adopted under the Atomic Energy Act. Those secrets cannot be automatically declassified by the president alone and require, by law, extensive consultation with executive branch agencies.

Edit: I do want to add, however, that the extent of a president’s legal authority to unilaterally declassify materials — without following formal procedures — has yet to be challenged in court.
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Don't disagree with the logic but the reality is precedent will matter. At least for a few of the actual charges. Obstruction and lying of course will be adjacent but those don't carry jail time sentencing.

The ruling also determined that “a president’s discretion on what are personal vs. official records is far-reaching and solely his, as is his ability to declassify or destroy records at will,” the report explained.

“Under the statutory scheme established by the PRA, the decision to segregate personal materials from Presidential records is made by the President, during the President’s term and in his sole discretion,” the judge said in 2012.

It stands as a precedent since it never was appealed.
 
jakefest said:
Don't disagree with the logic but the reality is precedent will matter. At least for a few of the actual charges. Obstruction and lying of course will be adjacent but those don't carry jail time sentencing.

The ruling also determined that “a president’s discretion on what are personal vs. official records is far-reaching and solely his, as is his ability to declassify or destroy records at will,” the report explained.

“Under the statutory scheme established by the PRA, the decision to segregate personal materials from Presidential records is made by the President, during the President’s term and in his sole discretion,” the judge said in 2012.

It stands as a precedent since it never was appealed.
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Trump is going to jail.
 
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jakefest said:
Don't disagree with the logic but the reality is precedent will matter. At least for a few of the actual charges. Obstruction and lying of course will be adjacent but those don't carry jail time sentencing.

The ruling also determined that “a president’s discretion on what are personal vs. official records is far-reaching and solely his, as is his ability to declassify or destroy records at will,” the report explained.

“Under the statutory scheme established by the PRA, the decision to segregate personal materials from Presidential records is made by the President, during the President’s term and in his sole discretion,” the judge said in 2012.

It stands as a precedent since it never was appealed.
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Don't disagree. It's all going to come down to the upcoming lawsuits as it'll be the first time this particular situation is challenged in court.

Also, the type of classified materials that were removed will determine whether Jackson's standing will hold, as nuclear information is covered separately. The part I just can't seem to fathom is the right is just showing their glaring hypocrisy in not seeming to give a shit about Trump just randomly removing classified information, lying about doing it, and attempting to block the collection of them (by his own lawyers' claim.)
 
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