Should Public schools reopen this fall

[JSpears5]

I’m not disputing the numbers. Rather trying to point out that the percentage is extremely low.

I edited my post, as it seems the NY TImes numbers are right. We went from 400 cases a day to 2000

At this growth, where does it end. We have tripled the total cumulative cases in the last month form 17,000 to 49000 and adding 100 deaths and 2000 cases a day. This is all before the July 4th crunch that is sure to come.

The way SC is handling it is beyond horrific. It is in the conversation for worst in world.

Europe and Asia are done with this thing for the most part. They are going back to their lives and we think it is more important to not have masks on and look like idiots with a case rate 60x higher than central Europe and CHina

 

[kgwillison]

I am reasonable. I’m not blaming this on Democrat’s. I’m saying the states that carried this across the lines and spread it at alarming rates happen to be democratic states. And I didn’t see leadership coming from there saying not to do that. So I find the “this is all from lack of leadership from Trump” to be anything more than disingenuous.

I would argue that the states that did the best job managing the crisis have Dem leaders. I have not heard any legitimate expert suggest that people in NY or NJ or Washington state are responsible for the outbreaks in SC, Fla., Texas, or Arizona. Rather, this is the way viruses spread ... from denser populations to less-dense ones.

However, it is clear that states with GOP-led administrations have looked to Trump and his reluctance to wear a mask as justification for their not wearing masks. So here we are: months after the onset of the crisis in densely populated states (or states with many Asian visitors), the pandemic is spreading like wildfire in areas where they essentially disregarded the CDC's various guidances on opening in phases.

The problem in these problem states is poor leadership. They opened too early guided largely by a narcissistic president who figured an improved economy was the only hope for his re-election.

 

[JSpears5]

I would argue that the states that did the best job managing the crisis have Dem leaders. I have not heard any legitimate expert suggest that people in NY or NJ or Washington state are responsible for the outbreaks in SC, Fla., Texas, or Arizona. Rather, this is the way viruses spread ... from denser populations to less-dense ones.

However, it is clear that states with GOP-led administrations have looked to Trump and his reluctance to wear a mask as justification for their not wearing masks. So here we are: months after the onset of the crisis in densely populated states (or states with many Asian visitors), the pandemic is spreading like wildfire in areas where they essentially disregarded the CDC's various guidances on opening in phases.

The problem in these problem states is poor leadership. They opened too early guided largely by a narcissistic president who figured an improved economy was the only hope for his re-election.

As a republican, this hurts me because it is true

I will say, I was okay with opening back up, but the disregard for others by treating covid like it was over was crazy. If people would wear a mask, this would be over by now, not climbing out of control

 

[shortbus22]

I would argue that the states that did the best job managing the crisis have Dem leaders. I have not heard any legitimate expert suggest that people in NY or NJ or Washington state are responsible for the outbreaks in SC, Fla., Texas, or Arizona. Rather, this is the way viruses spread ... from denser populations to less-dense ones.

However, it is clear that states with GOP-led administrations have looked to Trump and his reluctance to wear a mask as justification for their not wearing masks. So here we are: months after the onset of the crisis in densely populated states (or states with many Asian visitors), the pandemic is spreading like wildfire in areas where they essentially disregarded the CDC's various guidances on opening in phases.

The problem in these problem states is poor leadership. They opened too early guided largely by a narcissistic president who figured an improved economy was the only hope for his re-election.

So the democratic states get zero blame and Trump gets it all? I am totally shocked you believe this. Shocked, I tell you.

I guess all the northerners who flocked to Charleston and Myrtle Beach, and would tell anyone they came in contact with why they were there, had zero fault. That damn Trump did it again!

Even those of us who try hard to stay in the middle cannot because of people like you. And I fully recognize there are blow hards on the right who I hold equal disdain for.

BOTH SIDES SCREWED THIS UP. BOTH SIDES ARE SCREWING UP FIXING IT. BOTH SIDES ARE SO BUSY THROWING MUD THAT THE COUNTRY IS IN THE WORST POSITION I HAVE SEEN IT IN MY 42 YEARS. YET NEITHER SIDE ADMITS ANY BLAME. MAKES ME WANT TO PUKE.

 

[ArmyTiger27]

I was in that boat. I think losing about 25 lbs has helped (along with the associated improvement in diet, plus running my ass off).

Good for you!!!!!!! Keep it up!!!!!!

 

[tigergrad03]

I edited my post, as it seems the NY TImes numbers are right. We went from 400 cases a day to 2000

At this growth, where does it end. We have tripled the total cumulative cases in the last month form 17,000 to 49000 and adding 100 deaths and 2000 cases a day. This is all before the July 4th crunch that is sure to come.

The way SC is handling it is beyond horrific. It is in the conversation for worst in world.

Europe and Asia are done with this thing for the most part. They are going back to their lives and we think it is more important to not have masks on and look like idiots with a case rate 60x higher than central Europe and CHina

The way I see it is this shouldn’t be a surprise given everything opening back up, protests, people gathering together, spectator events taking place (because they are I’ve been there a lot) and other factors. Masks are not the cure. A vaccine isn’t the cure. It also shouldn’t be a shock given the testing has been dramatically increased. I would bet SC had numbers higher than this 2-3 months ago and no one knew. And 100 deaths is very telling. If we assume that the numbers are in fact correct, then the good news is it isn’t anywhere near what we’ve been told at this point. Are people going to die from it? Yes. Is it going to get better? Yes, but probably not before it appears to be worse. Common logic suggests that given 42% of all the recorded deaths have occurred in NY, NJ and MA, something is off. South Carolina is nothing like those places. How can Georgia with a city like Atlanta be different? It doesn’t make sense.

 

[tigergrad03]

I would argue that the states that did the best job managing the crisis have Dem leaders. I have not heard any legitimate expert suggest that people in NY or NJ or Washington state are responsible for the outbreaks in SC, Fla., Texas, or Arizona. Rather, this is the way viruses spread ... from denser populations to less-dense ones.

However, it is clear that states with GOP-led administrations have looked to Trump and his reluctance to wear a mask as justification for their not wearing masks. So here we are: months after the onset of the crisis in densely populated states (or states with many Asian visitors), the pandemic is spreading like wildfire in areas where they essentially disregarded the CDC's various guidances on opening in phases.

The problem in these problem states is poor leadership. They opened too early guided largely by a narcissistic president who figured an improved economy was the only hope for his re-election.

NY, NJ and MA account for 42% of ALL RECORDED DEATHS IN THIS COUNTRY. Yea they did it right

 

[kgwillison]

So the democratic states get zero blame and Trump gets it all? I am totally shocked you believe this. Shocked, I tell you.

I guess all the northerners who flocked to Charleston and Myrtle Beach, and would tell anyone they came in contact with why they were there, had zero fault. That damn Trump did it again!

Even those of us who try hard to stay in the middle cannot because of people like you. And I fully recognize there are blow hards on the right who I hold equal disdain for.

BOTH SIDES SCREWED THIS UP. BOTH SIDES ARE SCREWING UP FIXING IT. BOTH SIDES ARE SO BUSY THROWING MUD THAT THE COUNTRY IS IN THE WORST POSITION I HAVE SEEN IT IN MY 42 YEARS. YET NEITHER SIDE ADMITS ANY BLAME. MAKES ME WANT TO PUKE.

What I am saying is that virus eventually migrate. Everywhere. We had a golden opportunity to learn from what happened in NYC, in NJ, in California and in Washington (as well as what happened overseas). But we blew it. And a large portion of that responsibility was because even though the Trump administration published guidelines for opening states cautiously, the president disregarded them and urged faster re-openings.

Just yesterday, he disregarded his own CDC's guidelines for school openings and said they were too hard. He told CDC to revise them.

We are letting Trump's state of mind override science.

A virus doesn't care whether it is in a blue or red state. It just moves from person to person. The way to stop it is to physically distance, wear masks, wash hands, etc.

Early on, I will acknowledge that Dem mayors and governors did not take COVID seriously enough. But we should have learned after months of seeing people dying. The south and west should have taken stronger precautions. Damn, they KNEW how deadly it was. But the leaders there didn't. And so we are here now. And here probably means few students will go to school every day; many colleges will have online only classes; and sports will take another 3 month holiday.

 

[nsp1996]

...

However, it is clear that states with GOP-led administrations have looked to Trump and his reluctance to wear a mask as justification for their not wearing masks. ....

How is this clear?

Just because you might look to others to tell you what to think, or to be the "cause" of how you feel or act, doesn't mean that everyone is like that.

 

[kgwillison]

How is this clear?

Just because you might look to others to tell you what to think or to be the "cause" of how you feel or act, doesn't mean that everyone is like that.

I think it is pretty clear that the leaders of Fla., Texas and Arizona have eagerly followed Trump's urging that they open up their states for business. And I think it is pretty clear they opened so fast that they are paying the price.

On the other hand, my state of Va. was one of the first to place a long stay-in-place order (until June 15) and everywhere I go people in Northern Va readily comply with store policies to wear face masks. The governor blew off Trump's demand to "Liberate Va." Is it any wonder that Va is one of the states with a stable or declining number of cases? And it isn't like I live in rural Va., this is a densely populated part of the country.

 

[tigergrad03]

I think it is pretty clear that the leaders of Fla., Texas and Arizona have eagerly followed Trump's urging that they open up their states for business. And I think it is pretty clear they opened so fast that they are paying the price.

On the other hand, my state of Va. was one of the first to place a long stay-in-place order (until June 15) and everywhere I go people in Northern Va readily comply with store policies to wear face masks. The governor blew off Trump's demand to "Liberate Va." Is it any wonder that Va is one of the states with a stable or declining number of cases? And it isn't like I live in rural Va., this is a densely populated part of the country.

So you agree with lockdowns and businesses being FORCED to close by THEIR government?

 

[CU Alumnus]

So you agree with lockdowns and businesses being FORCED to close by THEIR government?

I'll tell you a personal bitch of mine - businesses being forced to close and then it being chalked up as a product of the Free Market economy.

Once the government decided to tell law-abiding businesses they had to close, we pivoted away from a Free Market economy.

 

[tigergrad03]

I'll tell you a personal bitch of mine - businesses being forced to close and then it being chalked up as a product of the Free Market economy.

Once the government decided to tell law-abiding businesses they had to close, we pivoted away from a Free Market economy.

Agreed! Has to stop right now. If not they will destroy that part first

 

[nsp1996]

I think it is pretty clear that the leaders of Fla., Texas and Arizona have eagerly followed Trump's urging that they open up their states for business. And I think it is pretty clear they opened so fast that they are paying the price.

On the other hand, my state of Va. was one of the first to place a long stay-in-place order (until June 15) and everywhere I go people in Northern Va readily comply with store policies to wear face masks. The governor blew off Trump's demand to "Liberate Va." Is it any wonder that Va is one of the states with a stable or declining number of cases? And it isn't like I live in rural Va., this is a densely populated part of the country.

You said that, "it is clear that states with GOP-led administrations have looked to Trump and his reluctance to wear a mask as justification for their not wearing masks. "

Just because Trump might occupy a large portion of your thoughts it doesn't mean that he has some magic mind control over elected officials at the state level doing what they are suppose to do... make decisions for their states.

We need to keep the economy going.

 

[tiger1995]

THese are not my numbers, but it will not matter because you would not believe anyones numbers.

Here is the article from The New York Times https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/08/...vOraqeVk5G1cJrOBmHqOU3hmo7DbYZNpLkqJk3A6YEdMQ

Here is Harvard's study, SC slips to 4th worst in the country (Most of Europe is under 1 new cases a day per 100k. SC is at 30. Charleston is at 71

https://globalepidemics.org/key-metrics-for-covid-suppression/

So what’s your solution (besides throwing up a bunch of charts and graphs)? If we are making decisions based on this, let’s just cancel America and isolate ourselves for another year.

 

[nsp1996]

So what’s your solution (besides throwing up a bunch of charts and graphs)? If we are basing decisions based on this, let’s just cancel America and isolate ourselves for another year.

Look on the bright side, think of all the rioting and looting we would have time for!

 

[tigergrad03]

So what’s your solution (besides throwing up a bunch of charts and graphs)? If we are basing decisions based on this, let’s just cancel America and isolate ourselves for another year.

This is exactly what they want to do. They know the outcome of that and the consequences but they would love to lockdown everything and close all the businesses. Too bad for them that isn’t happening at least in the south.

 

[JSpears5]

So what’s your solution (besides throwing up a bunch of charts and graphs)? If we are making decisions based on this, let’s just cancel America and isolate ourselves for another year.

School should be online as much as possible so that the people that have to send their kid to school will have smaller class sizes. They will not hire more teachers, need to reduce the number of students.

Bit if the people that refused to wear a mask for the last 8 weeks would have worn them, the worst would be over now.

Short term selfishness turns into this, a long term problem.

We can only fight it by doing all those things that people have been refusing to do. Wear a mask and keep your distance

 

[jmh9713]

Yep, because when we chose to be teachers we could foresee a pandemic in 2020. Don’t be an idiot.

Why are you given a pass because of youe profession? Everyone else is getting laid off and you are getting paid to sit at your house and not provide the service.

my question to you...why are you different

 

[tigergrad03]

School should be online as much as possible so that the people that have to send their kid to school will have smaller class sizes. They will not hire more teachers, need to reduce the number of students.

Bit if the people that refused to wear a mask for the last 8 weeks would have worn them, the worst would be over now.

Short term selfishness turns into this, a long term problem.

We can only fight it by doing all those things that people have been refusing to do. Wear a mask and keep your distance

FALSE

 

[jmh9713]

School should be online as much as possible so that the people that have to send their kid to school will have smaller class sizes. They will not hire more teachers, need to reduce the number of students.

Bit if the people that refused to wear a mask for the last 8 weeks would have worn them, the worst would be over now.

Short term selfishness turns into this, a long term problem.

We can only fight it by doing all those things that people have been refusing to do. Wear a mask and keep your distance

I thought we did those things for months, and yet HERE WE ARE.

 

[JSpears5]

We have been doing it your way (I assume by your stance) for 8 weeks. Where are we now.

If we opened with a mask mandate where all these out of state people could not bring it to us at the beaches, we would be over the hump now.

Just do not send your teenagers to party without care, do not go to packed bars, this is not a hard concept

 

[JSpears5]

FALSE

Hell, how do you argue with this logic

Tell me your solution because powering through is not working

 

[tigergrad03]

Hell, how do you argue with this logic

Tell me your solution because powering through is not working

Use the medications that work regardless of all the red tape. If it works use it. Do what you feel is best for you. If that’s wearing a mask wear one. If that means staying home do it. But most importantly use the medications and treatments that work. Live life and let’s move forward. Because we cannot live under a lockdown and isolation until this goes away. It’s not going away.

 

[JSpears5]

Use the medications that work regardless of all the red tape. If it works use it. Do what you feel is best for you. If that’s wearing a mask wear one. If that means staying home do it. But most importantly use the medications and treatments that work. Live life and let’s move forward. Because we cannot live under a lockdown and isolation until this goes away. It’s not going away.

get disease, try not to die. Looks like you are treating the symptoms not the cause

 

[appalachiatiger]

Every state seems to have mismanaged at their moment of truth.

Maybe call the china virus a wash and blame everyone

Once 5 million infections happen in SC then we are good

 

[tigergrad03]

get disease, try not to die

Cool, good advise in general

Nope. Try not to but understand you cannot prevent it if it’s going to happen. And if you do it’s highly likely you won’t die. Especially if your doctor gives you the right medicine to treat you.

 

[FallsChurchTiger]

LOL that is hilarious. You are the one with reading comp problems here.

I was doing the same as you, making an observation on your observation. I wasn't attacking you, simply adding to the convo. I am attacking the liberal nature of most people I read on the internet and I think it's dumb. But...

My entire family is made of teachers. I know exactly what their choices are. My point is more that nobody knows what will happen if schools open, but we can't keep it closed due to fear of the unknown. And that is what most liberals are saying we should do. They are feeling for teachers that aren't even scared for themselves.

Fair point. And always appreciate your posts. All good.

In our area, large swath of teachers rebelled at a 2 day a week plan and want all virtual. So I'm channeling that, that's what I am seeing.

 

[tigergrad03]

get disease, try not to die. Looks like you are treating the symptoms not the cause

Missed one thing. How do you treat the cause? Doctors are lost as to what is causing a lot of the symptoms. I’m a huge fan of treating the cause but how does that happen with something that seemingly changes daily?

 

[jmh9713]

As a republican, this hurts me because it is true

I will say, I was okay with opening back up, but the disregard for others by treating covid like it was over was crazy. If people would wear a mask, this would be over by now, not climbing out of control

love the “this hurts because im a republican” post which is such a load of crap.

You know when you see that bs to just stop reading

 

[doodog]

Why are you given a pass because of youe profession? Everyone else is getting laid off and you are getting paid to sit at your house and not provide the service.

my question to you...why are you different

Not provide the service? What? You think I’ve been sitting on my hands since this started? We were asked to do something we had NO experience of training to do. We left school on Friday and were told Sunday evening everything is fully online.

Forgive my language but assholes like you have no clue what is going on. I bet you think I’ve been doing nothing all summer too, huh?

 

[appalachiatiger]

Not provide the service? What? You think I’ve been sitting on my hands since this started? We were asked to do something we had NO experience of training to do. We left school on Friday and were told Sunday evening everything is fully online.

Forgive my language but assholes like you have no clue what is going on. I bet you think I’ve been doing nothing all summer too, huh?

easier or harder teaching online?

whats some good and bad of what happened from your perspective?

 

[appalachiatiger]

a restaurant or a bar or a club

is more of a petri dish than a school

and those people are back at work not complaining

 

[appalachiatiger]

Fair point. And always appreciate your posts. All good.

In our area, large swath of teachers rebelled at a 2 day a week plan and want all virtual. So I'm channeling that, that's what I am seeing.

sounds like you got a bunch of pansie teachers

some of those kids parent went overseas and put their lives on the line for these teachers

now these same military vets are asking teachers to put their lives on the line for their kids

and they are SCARED to.

what a shame

everyone should have the courage to stand up to this china virus

i did not realize we had so many pu$$ies in this country

 

[FallsChurchTiger]

sounds like you got a bunch of pansie teachers

some of those kids parent went overseas and put their lives on the line for these teachers

now these same military vets are asking teachers to put their lives on the line for their kids

and they are SCARED to.

what a shame

everyone should have the courage to stand up to this china virus

i did not realize we had so many pu$$ies in this country

Here’s what I’m referring to: https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...f52012-b7aa-11ea-a8da-693df3d7674a_story.html

 

[nealchick]

You might want to check out an elementary school classroom before making a statement like this.

Well, I went to elementary school. I have 3 children, 19, 15, and 12 and went to all their classrooms. I don't think a teacher has to touch their students. Maybe we are spoiled in our district, we have smartboards, chalkboards and teachers that use teaching aids without the need to be within 6' of a student.

Also, do the masks work or not. If so, what's the issue with a teacher and students wearing them?

The science shows that children have not been transmitting the virus.

N---

 

[appalachiatiger]

Here’s what I’m referring to: https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...f52012-b7aa-11ea-a8da-693df3d7674a_story.html

so 2 options-

either

work 4 days a week from home

or

work 2 days in the classroom

im assuming the other day from home is in school? and the other 3 days is online learning?

but i see the deal

they are scared to jump in to either plan without knowing the specifics

timid

to me this is war

no time to waste

get kids back in school asap

their mental health cant be fixed as easy as their physical health

 

[nealchick]

Clearly never been in an elementary classroom before. Particularly a K4-1st grade one.

ok. As a father engaged in his 3 children's education, I take offense. Still don't agree that said teacher needs to touch or be that close, or can't wear a mask and wash his hands.

Get the schools open.

The science tells us that children are not spreading the virus.

N---

 

[appalachiatiger]

Well, I went to elementary school. I have 3 children, 19, 15, and 12 and went to all their classrooms. I don't think a teacher has to touch their students. Maybe we are spoiled in our district, we have smartboards, chalkboards and teachers that use teaching aids without the need to be within 6' of a student.

Also, do the masks work or not. If so, what's the issue with a teacher and students wearing them?

The science shows that children have not been transmitting the virus.

N---

could you imagine if the teacher had to clean up the plates and napkins of every student every day-

thats way more dangerous than standing in front of the classroom

 

[tigergrad03]

Well, I went to elementary school. I have 3 children, 19, 15, and 12 and went to all their classrooms. I don't think a teacher has to touch their students. Maybe we are spoiled in our district, we have smartboards, chalkboards and teachers that use teaching aids without the need to be within 6' of a student.

Also, do the masks work or not. If so, what's the issue with a teacher and students wearing them?

The science shows that children have not been transmitting the virus.

N---

People need to think past this 6 foot social conditioning BS. In a classroom it wouldn’t matter if they’re 10 feet apart. It’s in the air and the air exchange will happen regardless. This is in place for nefarious reasons. When is the last time any government official was actually concerned with what happens to people? If no one is sick they don’t make billions of dollars at big pharmaceutical companies. It’s in our faces. Anytime you watch something on TV you’ll see a commercial about a new drug that has more ways to kill you times 10 than help you. They even tell us that in the commercial.