Florida Covid Cases Out of Control
- Thread starter TMcGrady1
- Start date
Smoke & Mirrors, level 10
Dunno, but even NYC and northern Italy eventually got things to subside. Not sure you should be seeing people outside wearing masks unless they’re around people who aren’t from their own household or are in a crowd. But what seems especially foolish is going to hang out and drink inside in a crowded bar, or eating inside in a somewhat crowded restaurant, or going somewhere where you’ll be inside for an extended period of time with a bunch of other people from outside your household. Sounds like people went on vacation in Florida and got kinda lax with that stuff.
Are bars and restaurants still open in FL? Are people still fighting about wearing masks? Does anyone in these states even care? I am asking legitimately - it seems like the level of concern from 1 to 10 is at about a 3 down there.
People are going to go on vacation. People are going to go to restaurants. People are not going to wear a mask at a restaurant.
NO SIR. Trump thinks we are in a good place. Therefore we are in a good place. Deaths across the country were < 400 a couple of weeks ago.. we are now up into the 800, 900 range. But death rates are down. Trump and company can never admit they screwed the pooch, so they are going to keep telling folks how good it is. The folks on here believe it too.
please tell me you don’t believe this...
What's not to believe? Trump did say we were in a good place less than a week ago. You telling me you don't believe him and that Fauci is right... come on man.
I've been watching the death rates nationally myself ... they were WAY down in June (along with new cases). I saw a LOT of days in a row where the national deaths were below 400.
Now I think we HAVE to open up, but there's no doubt that we did it in stupid way... we went from lockdown to nothing in a lot of states. You are saying that Trump's not wearing a mask, minimizing the risk, holding rallies, and openly supporting anti mask protests didn't help that?
Just explain to me how Trump screwed the pooch when the governors are in control of what is going on here. Trump and his team were just following what his Dr. were telling him to do (Fauci and Birch). Guidelines were put out by the CDC (inaccurately and still are) about what to do here. There are statistics and damn statistics. Some governors (NY) and mayors (NYC) have completely destroyed their economies and mismanaged this whole thing (placing positive COVID patients into nursing homes). The federal government sent in hospital ships, cleared out hospitals (to accommodate these patients) and in return, these hospitals shut down elective surgeries that are the life blood of the hospital systems creating layoffs and furloughs.
Prisma Health is a classic example of what happened here and we may have irreparably damaged our health care system. The pharmacy department where I worked for over 40 years reduced all pharmacists to half time because elective surgeries were stopped and hospital beds were empty. We weren't prepared for the increase in PPP that were needed or ventilators that were viewed as needed (Cuomo here and other governors) because previous administrations didn't do a damn thing to deal with this possible pandemic issue after being suggested to do so. And then responding by asking car companies to make ventilators, PPP, etc. Trump and his team suggested that governors reopen their economies and some governors have chosen to do that (tax revenues) and some have not (locked down states). NYC, once a great place to visit, will never be the same and I for one will never go back there. You can't lock down an economy for an extended period of time (which we were teetering on the edge here) and expect companies and small businesses to survive with no revenue coming in and any of us (retired) to have a damn thing left to enjoy what we worked so hard to achieve.
Now, there is a great chance that we won't have football this fall (I coach at the HS level) and college football and if we do have Clemson football, it won't be like we are all used to being a part of. We've all gotten that survey. I for one am planning (hoping that we don't) sit this year out.
Liberals and the MMM want to blame Trump for everything and have been trying to cut his nuts off for 3-1/2 years when in fact they gave the last administration a free pass on ANYTHING and EVERYTHING!!! Could spikes in numbers be attributed to protests, rioting, and looting? Can't go to church, restaurants, staying in your house, etc but can riot, loot, tear down historical statues in masses!! Doesn't fit the left's agenda because they want Trump out!!! I find it extremely odd, that all the previous efforts to get rid of this president (Russia collusion, bogus investigations, impeachment) have failed because there was nothing there to begin with and this country has had to deal with this crap. Now we have rioting, looting, pandemics and of course, let's blame Trump.
I for one, don't want to get into any arguments here, but we all have our own views here, and trust me, I have read enough on here to think I am now on Facebook every time I get on here.
I drove by sliding rock yesterday and there must have been 400 people all over each other in no way protecting themselves. Pisgah was packed and a lot of people weren't wearing masks. We would have beaten this thing long ago but for that type of attitude.
welcome back. was wondering where you were. it's been a war zone.
here is an analogy
we all are on one side of a river
we must all get to the other side
the river is the virus
i think some of us think the river will dry up and we can walk across a dry bed
we can wait for that to happen
or we can all just jump right in and cross it as quickly as possible
then
as ventilators and beds are needed
we set up temp sites
then the virus will pass on and we can get life back to normal
or we can continue this slow motion spread and take 2 years to get everyone across the river
and on a side note
their are communist coming after your 401ks and your saving accounts saying it belongs to the people- they call themselves democrats and are represented by a jackass
I live in North Carolina. Just an average state. Sweden and NC have almost the identical number of people. The Swedes have a more homogeneous and generally healthy population than NC. They also have 4.5 times as many deaths as NC.
I don't care how many people get Covid-19 or test positive, but the death count is very significant. Most of the 'open up, no mask' crowd will be asymptomatic or recover quickly from Covid. But they are also going to kill their Moms and Dads, Grandmas and Grandpas and the nice older man who works at the convenience store they frequent because he has to have the money. You can rest assured very very few of the 'open up, no mask' crowd has a child who is a physician.
I'm not advocating it, but it would literally take an asteroid strike or the second coming to get the governor to close restaurants again during tourist season. Think about it- the state of SC decides when schools can operate based on what the tourist industry wants. There is absolutely nothing that will slow the harvesting of money from out of state visitors, not even sickness or death.
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So you want people to wear mask while swimming and hiking outside? Good grief.
Quoting raw death numbers for covid is problematic due to the number of dead that are "lumped in" as covid caused when in reality it was something else that killed them.
this snippet from msn FGS " On Tuesday, the CDC changed the way it will publish death counts for COVID-19 to include "probable" deaths that may not have a confirmed laboratory test." But they still conclude covid deaths not inflated
Here is a good article on this from April
https://canadafreepress.com/article/the-cdc-confesses-to-lying-about-covid-19-death-numbers
And a video where a Doctor explains how this happens
Exactly...I don't understand why people can't see this!! And yes the virus is real...and we all need to do our part!!
What are the better treatment options? Seriously, I haven't heard of any changes to the standard ventilator protocol.
I'm in the open everything up, wear a mask if you want to crowd.....at least 50% of the people I genuinely care about are in front line healthcare. Most of whom agree that we cannot close down the economy again and their initial panic about the virus was an overreaction. Most believe that masks are effective and will wear them at the grocery store but rarely wear them elsewhere.
I'm totally ok with any business requiring a face covering....I really don't understand people complaining about that. I'll just shop or eat elsewhere if I don't want to wear a mask. But the logic behind it sometimes makes zero sense....for example, the restaurant that requires a face covering to enter the building but not at your table, as if the virus takes a break from spreading while you hoof down your bacon cheeseburger. And before you give me the "well the tables are 6 ft apart" bit....do some research, droplets aren't limited to a 6 ft space, especially with a cough/sneeze or when air conditioning is involved in an enclosed space.
Cancelled a few trips already however we plan a vacation to a remote wildlife Safari in Ohio. Nothing beats a weekend or a few days of gambling
The really scary thing is that you actually BELIEVE what you are saying. Forget the fact that when this was starting to ramp up that Trump was in SC saying that it was a Democratic hoax and so was FoxNews.
Trump has been pushing the country to reopen since the first part of April, telling us all that this was going to just go away when the weather warmed up. Yes, the Federal Government sent in some ships and equipment to help out with troubled areas... you act as if this is something special that Trump should be getting credit for... he was just doing what every president has ever done in an emergency.. sent some aid. In other words, just doing his job. He PUNTED on handling this. Letting the state's governors handle everything and setting up a system where the states were LITERALLY bidding against each other for available equipment. He wouldn't shut the country down, claiming (falsely of course) that he didn't have the power. Then a couple of weeks later he claimed he had the power to open everything back up even if the governors didn't want to. Typical Trump. Praises himself for any success and blames any and everyone else for problems.
I give Trump credit for what he does right. And he's done some things right (including with this crisis). Cutting off travel with China. Good move. Ditto with Europe. We were too slow to shut the country down, b/c Trump didn't have the balls to do it himself and we had to wait for 50 people to make an obvious decision instead of one. THEN he refuses to wear a mask and praises protest groups who refuse to do so. Finally he pushes states to reopen and hosts rallies when he KNOWS that having these type gatherings are bad. He's NEVER listened to Fauci and company... why to do think you haven't see Fauci lately on these task force meetings. He disagreed with Trump... now he must be destroyed.
I'd give him a C- (AT BEST) for handling this. Mostly b/c he's stayed out of the way and let someone marginally less incompetent (Pence) handle things. He gets high marks for the use of tear gas and hiding in a bunker though.
I just came to read all the uninformed uneducated opinions. Majority of this board are not switching lanes. No matter the science, death toll, long term and short term effects, pleas and mandates this health pandemic has become TOO politicized. Look around the world and you see the countries that politicized COVID 19 are paying a big price.
You were one of the lucky ones that had good parents that taught common sense skills. We now live in an age where sense is no longer common! Don't expect that to change any time soon!
First of all let’s discuss the facts:
1. unless Trump called for martial law he cannot shut the country down. It’s funny the same people that say the federal government has no right to come into sanctuary cities and Prisons to rid of illegals are the same ones that state the POTUS should have stepped in and overrode states decisions of Covid.
2. The same people standing there mocking Trump (Pelosi, Fauci, and the Democrat party) are same ones who stood in NY and told people to go about life as usual, refused to shut down, skewed the numbers, and were sending Covid infected people to nursing homes when they didn’t want them. I was on a call on Feb when the CMS clearly stated that hospitals could not force skilled facilities to take patients but they did waive the 3 day wait period.
3. The people that stated the federal government did not have a plan are foolish. I sat on calls with the HHS, CDC, DHEC, and SCDHEC from February on and listened. I’ll just state that SC was much more prepared than a lot of state hospitals and other states agencies based on questions and protocol and procedures that I heard on those calls. Very much worked together on telehealth plans, on-site and off-site testing facilities, drive thru testing for healthcare workers, forcing healthcare workers and patients and anyone providing care in long term care facilities to be tested (which was extreme to me but still), etc.
4. The federal government continued to offer siggestions, guideline, and held weekly calls that were available to anyone in healthcare from sales guys like me, to hospital executives and staff, to hospices to skilled facilities etc. And still have calls moving forward I believe...I stopped them be cause got repetitive
5. SCDHEC set up emergency PPE surplus supply and anyone who reached out to them got on the list and were regularly provided free product.
6. HHS emergency supply was greatly lacking. You can blame Trump if you like since he technically oversees it. You can blame the organization for not replacing the masks used under Obama. You can blame Obama for not assuring they were restocked but the fact is there was never going to be enough PPE in stock in emergency supply, distribution world or anywhere else. Impossible to keep the levels needed to meet supply. Simply supply chain management would have told you that so it’s not Trump nor Obama not the HHS’ fault
7. copied from FB of a nursing home owner from CDC reports:
CDC
New data on COVID-19 is available daily," the document said. "Information about its biological and epidemiological characteristics remain limited, and uncertainty remains around nearly all parameter values."
The document includes five scenarios. The first four are varying estimates of the disease's severity, from low to high, while the fifth represents the "current best estimate."
The range of estimates put the fatality rate for those showing symptoms between 0.2%-1%, with a "best estimate" of 0.4%.
It also places the number of asymptomatic cases between 20%-50%, with a "best estimate" of 35%.
By combining the two estimates, the estimated overall fatality rate of those infected with the virus – with and without symptoms – would be 0.26%.
According to NPR, the CDC has revised the estimate downward from its estimate in mid-April. Internal versions of the CDC scenario documents acquired by the Center for Public Integrity show that on April 14, the CDC had estimated a 0.33% fatality rate. That was up from a March 31 estimate of 0.16%.
8. That same owner has Multiple nursing homes in 3 states...1 death. I deal in long term care a lot and while they are more vulnerable for sure the death rate is nowhere near what they want you to believe
9. The death rate in SC is well below 1%
10. According to John Hopkins, 40 other countries have higher death rates than the US so even with higher case numbers, based on reported info available, the US has a really solid recovery rate. In fact, the UK is 4X higher than us in the case fatality rate. Our medical teams and our country is doing very well when it comes to survival or not even having to be hospitalized which is most cases of people I have known with it outside of a couple older folks.
AND ALL THIS...hear me out on this IMPORTANT POINT: even with these really good case fatality rates the definition
When you pass away, no matter how, whether on hospice, car wreck, or if you fall off a cliff...if you have a positive Covid diagnosis you are listed as a Covid death. And in the beginning people with symptoms that hadn’t been tested were being listed as Covid deaths because of the money.
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so Fauci who clearly stated you didn’t need a face covering in the beginning and did a 180 shortly after gets a high mark but Trump, who is not clinical and without martial law, cannot shut states down, gets low marks. We’ve seen how democrat lead states act when Trump tries to get federal agencies involved in their state rights with illegals. If he tried to shut it down that would have revolted just because he wanted them to shut down.
I hope there are people putting this kind of info in decision makers’ ears especially college football
We are supposed to go on vacation in the keys departing CAE on the 25th and arriving in Miami to rent a car. Other than the airport and to pick up the rental car we don't intend on spending any time in Miami. Seriously debating canceling for the second time....
Is it safe to still go?? We really are on the fence. As long as we can hang by the pool, boat a little, and go out to eat that's about the extent of our contact with others. We are not party/late night people so the bars closing at 11 won't effect us but we would like to dine out....
Is it safe to still go?? We really are on the fence. As long as we can hang by the pool, boat a little, and go out to eat that's about the extent of our contact with others. We are not party/late night people so the bars closing at 11 won't effect us but we would like to dine out....
Just a question for you. When you're a republican president, you know any issue that arises you're going to get 100% blamed and savaged for in the media and by the Democrats. This is tried, tested and unfortunately, effective in a country filled with a lot of very ignorant people. One need look no further than Katrina to see how a totally false narrative can 100% work. Do you want the current administration to just fall on its sword and not fight this narrative driven criticism?
The President is not responsible for the behavior of the people. If you look at the outlined behaviors in the opening plan they put forth, people just didn't follow them. Especially with the protests. Georgia opened in early May. We had no problems until about 2 weeks after the protests. What's not talked about is the protests had a dual effect. People got infected from going but more than that, people saw that the narrative of stay inside was just dropped and everyone was encouraging protests. So folks who didn't care about the protests but wanted to get out started going out because if it's OK for protesters, it's OK for them too. This unwound a lot of progress that had been made. That's just the reality whether people want to face it or not. Anyone who believes otherwise is blind to reality or totally in this for the politics. There's a lot of that right now.
Bottom line is we've been told so many conflicting bits of information and no one really seems to know what the hell they are talking about. There's been so much bad information and so much hyperbole that it's just turned into one long running "boy who cried wolf" scenario. The news media bears so much responsibility for this because they see it as a way to accomplish so many of their goals. I don't think anyone wants people to die but they sure as hell do want to make as much off this crisis as they possibly can. It's been a horrible and corrosive time for the country. I may be cynical but I don't know how we put things back together again. If we had ANY CREDIBLE institution that would truly deal in facts it would help but I haven't seen one anywhere...
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This. WTF is wrong with people thinking they'll wear a mask while hiking? That is not healthy in this heat.
@firegiver are you on drugs?
Trump this, Democrats that. it is laughable that voters cannot see that Ds and Rs are playing politics at a time when they should be working together WRT Covid to help Americans. Isn't that what their job is?
Lastly, does freedom to not wear a mask mean cigarette smoke will no longer be restricted? Let's at least have "no mask required" zones and keep track of the mask vs no mask virus cases. Zone the beaches, bars, etc.
Lastly, does freedom to not wear a mask mean cigarette smoke will no longer be restricted? Let's at least have "no mask required" zones and keep track of the mask vs no mask virus cases. Zone the beaches, bars, etc.
When people get sick, their body produces a fever to kill off the bacteria that cannot survive above 100° temperatures (hence why taking Tylenol actually makes you sicker longer because it limits your body’s ability to do its job)
when the Earth has a sickness (people, pollution, etc), what do you think it’s response is going to be, as a living organism? A fever! (Natural disasters, pandemics, etc)
You are correct on Fauci. Fauci follows the science. When the early numbers came out and said that the masks didn't keep you from becoming infected, Fauci followed the science. When more data came in saying that masks protected others from you Fauci did a 180. He followed the science. If more experiments indicate that
Dude that's both sides of the aisle and it's not new. Any time Obama tried to do anything... same thing from the right. The only difference is the amount of whining Trump does compared to any other President.
The president isn't responsible for other's behavior, BUT what he says and does has an affect. Publically saying MULTIPLE time on how this was all going away soon. Openly disagreeing with his medical experts that are making policy for the country, refusing to wear a mask, and openly supporting people protesting wearing masks and pushing for reopening even though the states had not reached the goals required by his own taskforce to do so all hurt the country and the fight against COVID.
As any scientist can tell you. When you are dealing with something new, there's a learning curve. Some of the things you thought you knew were correct, some are not. All you can do is follow the science and adjust as the numbers come in. It can be confusing and frustrating for sure, too bad the POTUS didn't bother to address the country about that and instead added to the confusion by pushing unproven treatments and nonsense about UV light and household disinfectants.
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