That's easy to explain. Trump on the ballot is the single biggest motivator in the world for democrat turnout. And he's turned off moderates as well as some Republicans. Trump running = democrat victory.
Why Insane Liberals Deserve Better Than the Jan 6 House Comittee Hearing Rules
- Thread starter PalmettoTiger1
- Start date
That's easy to explain. Trump on the ballot is the single biggest motivator in the world for democrat turnout. And he's turned off moderates as well as some Republicans. Trump running = democrat victory.
Homey, I hate to break it to you, but if you don’t think Desantis is going to get the Trump treatment, you’re in for a rude awakening
Even if he gets some of the same "treatment," there is a giant chasm between him and Trump's baggage.
I get that. But they’re going to run smear campaign after smear campaign on him just like they’ve done Trump, Kavanaugh, ACB, etc until they get what they want. It doesn’t matter who runs, there is going to be rampant faux outrage and nothing will get fixed
Trump is an easier target, but at this point what difference does it make?
He's a lot smarter than Trump. He's also more disciplined and understands politics more. He's not out to celebrate himself and all things the way Trump is.
I do not agree with this prevailing theory on 2020 of course. You are stating that 10 to 20 million liberal dem leaning voters will just sit out the potus election that occurs once every 4 years if Trump is not on the ballot? Keep in mind that Trump got 74M votes which is more than any potus in any election ever except for China Joe who is supposed to have got 81M somehow. You guys believe Trump hate accounted for the greatest turnout in history and I think the Establishment stole the election.
I would think it will be higher turnouts going forward no matter what if 2020 was legit. People that vote tend to always do it imo. I can't see Trump hate/love accounting for an extra 20M votes honestly. What exactly did Trump do to generate that kind of hate? We know what Trump did to have so many love him. I will take more money and great economy 7 days a week and twice on Sunday. Yall are just buying this msm version of how it went down without a lot of deep thought into imo.
If this were true it would have happened after JFK and Clinton. Two pos presidents who used their power and position to at, the very least, take advantage of college age women they employed, and in Clinton's case had been accused of rape by multiple women dating back from the time he was governor.
There are a significant number of republican women(and a smaller group of men) that did not, and will not vote for him simply bc they think he is mean and their emotional response to that will override anything else. I'm not saying they all will vote dem, but many of them did not, and will simply not vote or write in a candidate that has no chance. There are even more independents that fall in this category. This happened in the last election, and the problem has only become worse since then. I don't like Trump as a person, but I would vote for him against any dem candidate bc he would be better than the alternative. However, there are many people that can not separate their feelings about him as a person with fact that he may be the better candidate. I'm not saying this is logical, but it is true.
The big difference in dems and pubs, is that dems will vote for their candidate no matter what. They will hold their nose and vote for someone they don't like, and maybe don't agree with just bc of he "D" beside their name. Many pubs are not willing to do that. If you looked at the exit polls and interviews after the election, it was clear that some of the suburban, mostly conservative , women did not vote for him even though the were traditional pub voters.
Just these bolded statements shows how moronic your beliefs are. If Trump sent multiple armed protestors to storm the capitol on Jan6, what happened to them? There was not one shot fired and no one in the building was found with a gun? How do you explain that? Not one person with a gun out of all the people sent there by trump to overthrow the govt and hang pence. PLEASE explain this. Also, if it was planned, how could the people who breeched be so inept? They clearly had no idea where they were going, no plan to be able to breech locked interior doors, evidently no knowledge of evacuation protocols, and no weapons to confront secret service if they had actually found anyone. What part of that scenario suggests to you that it was a pre planned attack aided by people that would have had intimate knowledge of the building and security protocols? None of the events of that day support any of the stupidity being espoused by you and others who are clearly detached from reality.
Are you telling me the most powerful man in the world and his associates plan was to have a group of unarmed supporters wander around the capitol blindly in hopes of running into pence and the legislators and somehow get past armed secret service and other police by throwing flags and furniture at them- all while many of them were taking selfies and recording themselves sitting with their feet propped up desks in the building?
There is a quote attributed to Einstein that refers to people like you.
ARMED FOLKS IN CROWD WAS SUBSTANTIATED WITH EVIDENCE. SHOWED GUY IN TREE IDENTIFIED BY POLICE BEFORE THE SPEECH WITH AR-15--EVEN HAVE DESCRIPTION OF CLOTHING ETC.
The point is that Trump knew they were armed because he wanted the metal detectors taken away and said THEY WEREN'T GOING TO SHOT HIM so it was ok.
YOU ALL OBVIOUSLY DIDN'T WATCH THE HEARINGS OR THE EVIDENCE AND KNOW NOTHING. I ALSO PUT THIS IN BOLD TO SHOW HOW MORONIC YOUR STATEMENTS ARE.
DID YOU WATCH THE HEARINGS? If you did you wouldn't be asking him these IDIOTIC questions - the same fuggin spiel you've vomited on this board repeatedly for a year and a half!
If you would still vote for that man and still come on here and provide your brainless word mash every time this subject comes up, after what she testified to on Tuesday, you are no patriot - you are an enemy of the state!
If you haven't watched SHUT THE HELL UP UNTIL YOU DO!
Thank you for taking time to post
My point which everyone seems to be missing and I want to reiterate is that the process set up by the Democratic controlled House does not allow fair Due Process to the accused and I would not want this process to be applied to any person
And to answer your question I have read a lot but not all of the many fake and real reports which leads to my statement that Due Process is important to any accused person when they are being Accused of anything
We can make all kinds of grand accusations in the newspaper , TV , on web sites , message boards , etc. however biasing a narrative one sided and limiting the ability of an accused to challenge any claims is not a fair process
I can sit here all day and dispute everything that you write and you can do the same with me challenging every claim I make
The point again is non biased due process needs to be practiced and the rule
The Jan 6 hearing are a mockery of lawful behavior
The Mueller report was laughable based on the evidence now showing there was an insurrection against Trump by the Deep state which included Obama , Hillary Clinton, many elected and appointed government positions along with employees of the US
So to further inflame your rhetoric the worse threat to a Republican Democracy in the US is not the left wing claims that constantly are being mouthed by the left wing media is the left wing media and deep state
Keep writing and talking as the solution to our problems needs to be dialogue in the public forum
If Republicans cared more for our country than one man, the commission would have been equally split between R and D. They had their chance but decided to put two co-conspirators on the panel - one of whom even discussed pre-emptive pardons before Trump left office. You don't try to put two foxes in the hen house if you are serious. Nancy did the right thing by keeping three and turning those two down but allowed McCarthy to replace them with two others. McCarthy then decided to pull all of them out of fake indignation, though we know it was really because they knew Trump was guilty and wanted to be able to accuse the commission of being unfair - just like you're doing here.
If equal time is the issue, any Republican that wants to come forward with conflicting information is welcome to do so - especially Trump! The problem is they would have to do it under oath and so no surprise they'd rather throw stones from the sideline than be forced to tell the truth. Wonder why?
But as far as due process goes, that sounds like a trial - not a hearing. We'd all love to see that. At the end of this, you may just get your wish!
With all that you stated how did Trump get more votes than any incumbent potus in US history?
More people voted than ever before. It's not freaking rocket science.
They predicted this over a year before the election:
And access to voting was made universally easier during the pandemic, so the turnout was even greater across the board.
Voting highs
The 2020 presidential election is on track for record-breaking turnout
Turnout soared in 2020 as nearly two-thirds of eligible U.S. voters cast ballots for president
Americans voted in record numbers in last year’s presidential election, casting nearly 158.4 million ballots.
www.pewresearch.org
They were just laying the groundwork for the big steal and sent out talking points beforehand to set the stage. This discussion was on how it may or may not change depending on whether Trump runs or not anyway though.More people voted than ever before. It's not freaking rocket science.
They predicted this over a year before the election:
And access to voting was made universally easier during the pandemic, so the turnout was even greater across the board.
Voting highs
The 2020 presidential election is on track for record-breaking turnoutgraphics.reuters.com
Turnout soared in 2020 as nearly two-thirds of eligible U.S. voters cast ballots for president
Americans voted in record numbers in last year’s presidential election, casting nearly 158.4 million ballots.
So Trumps plan was to have one guy in a tree OUTSIDE the capitol, to take control of the people inside the capitol. Sounds pretty logical to me, how about you?
As to the bolded part, what in my description of what happened do you dispute? There are video's of what happened inside. Videos of actual events, not accounts by biased politicians of what they SAY happened. There are also first hand accounts from people in the building stating those that breeched were asking which way the senate chambers were, for example. Again, NOT ONE PERSON in the capitol had a gun. PLEASE explain how this is possible if Trump sent armed insurrectionist to take over the building and hang Pence. Just answer the questions with any kind of reasonable explanation and quit telling me to watch the prime time TV show. KI am not asking you to recount the whole hearing. Just give some plausible explanations for the events of that day.
Hello there @TigerGrowls . The January 6th hearings are a sham. I'm sure you agree with that and there has been woeful misrepresentation since the beginning. That's certainly true.
However, a lot of the things that I have read which don't go uncontested are concerning. Trump is a big baby. He may have gotten more votes than any incumbent in history but the country is growing and therefore it makes sense that we have more people voting for people in each election. Not to mention we have a very large adult population right now in this country. Voting statistics don't equal favor necessarily. See the fact that Biden got the most votes in history and he is quite likely the worst president we've ever had.
Donald Trump had some good policies but his temperament was just bad. His raging fit he had from November of 2020 through January of 2021 destroyed him for good with so many people. I've listened to numerous interviews since he left office and all he can talk about is himself and how he was cheated. He doesn't have a policy vision that's top of mind because he's too busy trying to re-litigate the 2020 election. He's not the person for the present or future of this country.
I respect your right to view things as you do of course but I do truly wish you'd venture outside the sphere you've placed yourself in and consider things from alternative angles. Trump is just a person. He's a very deeply flawed and corrupt person. Yes, he did some good things as president and certainly he was entertaining as he presented a giant middle finger to the leftist establishment. However those are all temporary things and for lasting and enduring change, someone else is needed. A stronger, more articulate, more unifying voice. That is never going to be the voice of Trump. Time to move forward.
I feel or see much of what you say
Trump has or had the right policy however his personality was not the best seller
That being said the liberals and Democrats might have had me acting crazy based on the mountain of lies being propagated
That said Trump must have liked how his feet tasted because he loved sticking them in his mouth
That along with having tweets that were really not necessary when you are President
of course back up to the lying Main Street media that would climb a greased pole to tell a lie on Trump rather than simply stand in the ground and tell the truth
That’s a lot of crazy to go around on all so I just am holding my nose when I vote
I'm not foolish enough to believe you really want the truth or that you will recognize the seriousness of the issue because in your imagined scenario it's not a coup unless it happens just like it would in Bangladesh. If it's not a coordinated mob with guns, who ransack the building and hold everyone hostage, it just can't be a coup. That's how it goes it your tightly scripted scenario that you've posted here a hundred times.
You won't allow yourself to see it through any other lens because that might mean your hero could be guilty. If your hero didn't have a mob go in with guns a blazing, he's innocent in your favorite fairy tale.
But what do you call it when a group conspires to ignore the will of the people and illegally stay in power? I don't care what you call it, that's what happened and it was depraved, not to mention illegal. That's the part you're ignoring but it has been thoroughly proven in the hearings, with more to come.
As far as the weapons go, IF YOU WOULD HAVE WATCHED THE HEARINGS, you would have heard her testimony in which she described the Secret Service communications saying there were lots of people on the Ellipse with weapons, including guns(they even played the SS audio). The Trump team was informed but they didn't want to do anything.
Later he became annoyed because the field wasn't full and he asked them to let the rest of the crowd in. When informed that they had weapons, he said he didn't care because they weren't there to hurt him and they could go to the Capitol from there. She heard that firsthand. That is despicable and no matter how you try to frame it, HE DIDNT CARE that they were marching to the Capitol with guns! That is sickening to know a President of the US wasn't concerned about the safety of the police or people at the Capitol. That may not have been scripted like they do it in Bangladesh but it was absolutely a threat to Congress - get it?
Cippilone became extremely concerned when the crowd started chanting Hang Mike Pence so he approached Meadows right outside of Trump's office and asked him to do something. Meadows told him Trump didn't want to do anything about it because Pence deserved it. HE DIDN’T CARE if Pence was killed. Get it?
Michael Fanone said they didn't have the ability to search everyone for weapons so there's another flaw in your fairytale. They didn't know how many had guns. Got it?
He tried 6-7:ways to overturn the will of the people but you won't blame him only because it was messy and it didn't succeed.
He's a sick sick man and regardless we know you'll come back with some bizarre pretzel logic to absolve him, but that will just make you a fool. Well actually you already are...
Once again you are hypnotized. Where did all these mentioned guns get used or were even seen. Conflicting reports state that none to possibly a few firearms were even found present on J6. The only gun shot was the murder of Ashley Babbitt. Hey man...why is Ray Epps not in jail?
I mean it when I say this and I'm not being sarcastic. You should be ashamed of yourself. You seriously have got to find your moral compass and get past your unhealthy obsession with this sociopath. It's time...
I am just stating known facts. Refute me convincingly and I will acknowledge it.
that's actually not at all what was testified. are you slow or you just prefer the newsmax version of everything?
Well we know the answer but good question to bring up anyway.
justthenews.com
Donald Trump questions why Jan. 6 witness Hutchinson isn't prosecuted for lying under oath
"If I was so evil, why did she fight so hard to stay a part of the MAGA TEAM? This is all documented in writing!" Trump wrote
justthenews.com
No. The point is that the crowd was armed. They have reports of multiple people with AR-15s, multiple with glocks. Trump knew the crowd was armed and dangerous and sent them to the Capitol--wanted to march with them. It shows that this wasn't spontaneous and that Trump knew the danger and sat on his hands and not only did nothing with the Capitol being attacked but sent them to stop Pence. At the time of the speech--Trump knows they are armed and dangerous.
Last time I am doing your homework for you: (its only 6 minutes)
You are wrong about rioters not being armed. It isn't your fault--if all you listen to is conservative media echo chambers, that false claim gets repeated often. They did find rioters that were armed in the Capitol:
Myth 2
People involved in the Capitol riot were not "armed" because they did not have any guns. (this is from 2021 and now there are more cases and the additional info from Jan 6th committee of AR15s in the crowd)The Cases
Guy Reffitt has been charged with illegally bringing a handgun on Capitol grounds on January 6. Reffitt allegedly told family members he “brought his gun with him” in the Capitol attack.Mark Ibrahim, who at the time was an off-duty special agent for the Drug Enforcement Administration, has been charged with bringing his service weapon on Capitol grounds during the insurrection as well as lying to the FBI about why he was at the Capitol.
Another individual, Cleveland Meredith Jr., is accused of possessing a pistol and rifle without “a registration for any firearm in Washington, DC,” which were recovered by the FBI a day after the insurrection. According to an officer statement, the individual arrived too late for the Capitol riot and talked about killing Pelosi in a text conversation.
Federal prosecutors say that Christopher Michael Alberts of Maryland was arrested on Capitol grounds on the evening of Jan. 6 while carrying a Taurus G2c 9 mm handgun with one round in the chamber and a full 12-round magazine. He also allegedly had an extra magazine in his pocket and was carrying a gas mask, pocket knife and first-aid kit. Christopher Alberts is accused of carrying a pistol and a large capacity ammunition device without a license into the U.S. Capitol on January 6.
Lonnie Leroy Coffman of Alabama was also arrested that evening after law enforcement found two firearms on his person, as well as what a federal judge referred to as a "small armory" in his truck, which was parked near the Capitol. According to the court, the government found "a loaded handgun," "a loaded rifle," "a loaded shotgun," "a crossbow with bolts," "several machetes," "a stun gun" and "11 mason jars containing a flammable liquid, with a hole punched in the top of each jar." According to the government, surveillance footage showed him "in attendance at the events at the Capitol," though he has not been charged with breaching the building. Pleaded GUILTY.
(cited above) Cleveland Grover Meredith of North Carolina planned to arrive in D.C. for the Trump rallies on Jan. 6, according to federal prosecutors, but he was delayed because of car trouble. He was arrested the following day for allegedly assaulting a man in Washington, D.C., in a traffic-related incident and for making death threats against the D.C. mayor and Pelosi.
During a search, law enforcement said they found in his possession "a Glock 19, nine millimeter pistol, a Tavor X95 assault rifle and approximately hundreds of rounds of ammunition." Citing text messages sent by Meredith, a federal prosecutor argued in court that he "relished in the carnage of January 6th."
The government's case against members of the far-right, anti-government militia known as the Oath Keepers alleges that the group discussed planning a "Quick Reaction Team" with weapons just outside Washington, D.C., on Jan. 6. One such defendant, Thomas Caldwell, allegedly wrote in a text message on Jan. 3, "we could have our Quick Response Team with the heavy weapons standing by, quickly load them and ferry them across the river to our waiting arms." Caldwell's attorney, meanwhile, has argued that references to such a team demonstrate that the group was purposely adhering to D.C.'s strict gun laws. Caldwell's attorney also argued that the messages were not about storming the Capitol, stating that the team was "nothing but a contingency plan hatched up by retired military guys strategizing in the event that Antifa launched a coordinated attack against rally-goers." (There is no evidence antifa played any role in the events of Jan. 6.)
Prosecutors believe other defendants in the Capitol riot possessed guns on Jan. 6, though those rioters were not arrested and searched for weapons that day.
For example, Guy Wesley Reffitt (cited above) allegedly "led a group of rioters up the Capitol steps" and "confronted law enforcement" but retreated after being pepper-sprayed. Reffitt was wearing tactical gear and "carrying his pistol" during the riot, according to the government, and also brought plastic flex cuffs.
Federal prosecutors say Reffitt is a member of the Texas Three Percenters, a far-right militia group. Reffitt's son told federal investigators that when Reffitt returned home from Washington, D.C., he brought an "AR-15 rifle and a Smith & Wesson pistol" in the house along with his other things. Reffitt was arrested on Jan. 18.
Samuel Fisher allegedly posted photos of himself, along with a rifle and handgun, in Washington, D.C., on Jan. 6. He posted on Facebook early that day that he was leaving things in a parking garage, "maybe except pistol," and added, "if it kicks off I got a Vest and My Rifle." Fisher was arrested on Jan. 20 and is facing charges of entering and remaining in a restricted building, as well as disorderly and disruptive conduct in a restricted building, but not weapons charges.
Nolan Cooke, another Capitol riot defendant, allegedly told FBI agents that he "brought one or more firearms" to Washington, D.C., but he claimed he did not bring the weapons to the Capitol itself. He was arrested on Jan. 21.
Those are just some of them. But you need to do your own research.
Like I said--hold your horses. Ornato is a political hack who has already been caught multiple times in clear lies, covering for Trump. In his defense, this is not uncommon for the SS.Well we know the answer but good question to bring up anyway.
Donald Trump questions why Jan. 6 witness Hutchinson isn't prosecuted for lying under oath
"If I was so evil, why did she fight so hard to stay a part of the MAGA TEAM? This is all documented in writing!" Trump wrote
BUT...RUH ROH growls...multiple SS members have now confirmed the account and said this was well known to have been repeated by many people in the SS. Only Ornato denying it BUT NOT UNDER OATH.
So--we have someone under penalty of perjury who said it and Ornato denying as a background leaker who hasn't said anything under oath. HE NEEDS TO TESTIFY, RIGHT?? And I think it is pretty clear that if he won't testify or comes up with a lame excuse--we can agree he is the liar.
Regardless, there is no actual challenge to Hutchinson's account now until he testifies. And even if he does--he is going to need more than he said, she said because others in the SS will come forward if he lies.
Ruh-roh is right lol. You try to tell these righties that their media echo bubble leads them astray but they never listen. Wonder how many will apologize for what they said about Cassidy now that the SS has corroborated her testimony. 😅
More receipts for you Growls. They have a video of Trump lunging towards the driver's side of the limousine on Jan 6th 😅
A reporter heard the same thing from law enforcement
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yeah. after people testify under oath you'll start to think they might be onto something.
I would argue that many independents would bite their tongue and vote republican straight down the ticket if the election were held today regardless of who’s the President, current approval from them is around 29% or 39% (my memory lacks me but I read this this morning) currently. Of course though, a lot can change from now until then.
Another piece of false testimony confirmed. She was no doubt guaranteed that she would not be indicated for all these pieces of false testimony.
www.thegatewaypundit.com
Pat Cipollone Was Not at the White House on Morning of January 6 as Cassidy Hutchinson Testified: Report | The Gateway Pundit | by Cristina Laila
Trump’s White House counsel Pat Cipollone was not at the White House on the morning of January 6 as J6 ‘surprise’ witness Cassidy Hutchinson testified.
www.thegatewaypundit.com
Lol, you still trust your sources? 😅Another piece of false testimony confirmed. She was no doubt guaranteed that she would not be indicated for all these pieces of false testimony.
Pat Cipollone Was Not at the White House on Morning of January 6 as Cassidy Hutchinson Testified: Report | The Gateway Pundit | by Cristina Laila
Trump’s White House counsel Pat Cipollone was not at the White House on the morning of January 6 as J6 ‘surprise’ witness Cassidy Hutchinson testified.
I never said there was no one in the crowd OUTSIDE the capitol that was armed. Of course there were- just like there were at every BLM/ANTIFA attended riot over multiple years. What I have said repeatedly is that no one in the capitol building was armed, no shots were fired and they did not seem to know where they were going- which flies in the face of there being some pre orchestrated coup attempt that trump and his associates were part of.
I am sure there were plans made by some groups to attend, just like all the other BLM/ANTIFA attended riots where people were bused in. It is ridiculous to think everyone there just woke up that morning and decided "hey, why don't I go to the capitol and protest!"
To your points:
If you are going to insist that trump "sent" them bc he called for them to march to the capitol with him during his speech that day then you also have to acknowledge he called for the protest to be PEACEFULLY bc that was in the very same speech, maybe even the same sentence. No surprise you conveniently left that out. Also not mentioned by you are at least two tweets by Trump calling for NO VIOLENCE and for people to go home and to respect law enforcement within about an hour of the capitol breech.
Finally, the percentage of people who were armed (with guns) was obviously extremely small. Best estimates indicate several thousand protestors that were actually at the capitol. I looked at about ten articles and the highest number I saw was 16 gun arrests. That is less than 1% of the crowd. We know they arrested over 700 people. Again, is it your opinion that Trump and his associates, in an effort to attempt a coup and take control of the capitol sent, summoned, or pre arranged for protestors to show up but told them only one or less out of each hundred could bring a gun and please keep the total under 20? Did he also tell them not to fire under any circumstances?
Also, there were anywhere from 10K-30K trump supporters at the mall. Did all those people he summoned there just suddenly stop listening to him when he "sent" them to the capitol?
I'm not saying Trump did nothing wrong, but all you lunatics suggesting this was some pre planned, organized attack on the capitol have completely detached from reality. NONE of the actual events of that day support this notion at all. Again, not one person in the capitol was found, seen, or reported to have a gun. Not ONE shot was fired ANYWHERE at, in, or around the capitol by protestors even though your claim is many of them were armed with the intent of causing harm to the point of murdering the vp.
Based on your account of what happened that day:
The only trump supporters with guns that made it to the capitol changed their mind about using them, and none of them actually made it in the capitol. Also, everyone that actually knew the layout of the capitol and were to lead the insurrectionist to hang the vp couldn't get in or got lost on the way since the insurrectionist that made it in did not go directly to the legislative chambers and evidently had no idea of escape/emergency protocols. What are the odds of that?
